Tire Size [Archive] - Honda Element Owners Club Forum

: Tire Size


djdiverdon
10-08-2004, 10:11 PM
Hello, Can someone tell me what is the biggest size tire you can put on the E stock wheels??? I would like to put on wider tires but still keep the same size height to keep the speedo accurate . How wide can you go without causing problems ??? Rubbing .. etc... Thanks..........

Empire
10-08-2004, 10:45 PM
Hmm, you might try a 235/65/16 size.
It will be a bit wider than the stock 215's and the speedo will only be off by a measly .4 mph.
I have no rubbing problems with 235/70/16s (1" taller) so those should be ok also.

paulj
10-08-2004, 11:35 PM
Selection in the 235/65/16 size is even more limited than in the 215/70/16 size. 235/60/16 has a larger selection, and may be a good choice for those who want to move in the lower profile 'performance' direction.

paulj

LittleDogBox
10-09-2004, 11:08 AM
[quote:69a87775a8=" "]Hmm, you might try a 235/65/16 size.
It will be a bit wider than the stock 215's and the speedo will only be off by a measly .4 mph.
I have no rubbing problems with 235/70/16s (1" taller) so those should be ok also.[/quote:69a87775a8]

Empire,
How much do you think your speedometer is off with the 235/70/16's being they are an inch taller ?
Time for new tires, I think I want some Michelins' but I am open to some suggestions. I know you have the Bridgestones. How is the wear on those since you have had them for a while now?

LittleDogBox
Arlington, Va.

paulj
10-09-2004, 12:08 PM
4%

Empire
10-09-2004, 04:04 PM
I don't really notice the speedo difference.
The Revos are holding up pretty well so far at over 20k miles.
No problems so far.

paulj
10-09-2004, 04:43 PM
With 225/70/16 tires the size increase is about 2%. This is consistent with a couple of measures:
- over a 5 mile 'speedometer test' section of freeway, my odometer was off by .1 mile
- the speed on my handheld GPS unit reads a couple of mph higher than the odometer (e.g 73 v 70)

I did not, though, test the speedometer against the stock tires, so can't say how well calibrated it was to start with.

paulj

dblair
10-10-2004, 11:20 AM
I think there is some question about the accuracy of the speedometer with the stock set up. The city I live in uses those portable speed check things quite a lot and I've noticed a pretty consistent variance (speedometer reads 3-4 MPH slower). Of course the problem may be with the machine.

Assuming that the odometer reading and the speedometer reading are consistant it would be interesting to check the E set up over a measured distance. Maybe a 235 70 actually corrects to the actual speed/distance.

deckeda
10-11-2004, 09:06 PM
Stay very close to the stock tire size tire on the stock rims. Wide tires on narrow rims will tend to perform poorer than narrower tires sized right for the rim's width.

Compare any tire's diamater with the stock Wrangler HP's 215/70/16 diameter in order to keep your odo close. Tire diameter is usually listed in the specs.

There's an acceptable range of wider you can go. However the ideal width for handling and gas economy is already installed on your Element.

If what you really want is a wider tire spend the bucks and get a wider rim too but sacrifice a smidgen of MPG as you gain some handling...

paulj
10-11-2004, 09:44 PM
Due to the limited clearance around the strut towers, you really can't go to extremes with tire sizes.

There are only 3 widths of tire that fit on the Element (without a change in offset) 215, 225 and 235. Most tires with these widths will fit on rims in the 6-8" range. The ideal for a 215 is likely to be 6 or 6.5, with the ideal for a 235 more likely being 7. People have successfully put all three widths on the stock rims. The tire specs include the rim width range.

The only alternative size that is real close to stock is 235/65/16, and that is less comon than stock. 225/70/16 and 235/60/16 are about 2% different (up and down), with 235/70/16 being 4% larger.

paulj

gawd06
10-12-2004, 09:15 PM
PaulJ....
What size tires do you run? Do you have 4wd? Have you ever taken your E off road in the mountains? I would like a little more clearence with a new tire. I want to use the stock EX wheel. Can I get the 235/70/16 on those wheels saftely with clearence in the wheel wells and without hitting when turning or over bumps? Have you changed your shocks or struts? Will this size clear with the struts? It sounds like you know you stuff. Can you answer my questions? Thanks, Gretchen

LEGO MY E
10-12-2004, 09:25 PM
hi everyone i'm trying to look for some tires but i don't know where to buy them because all the local tire shops are too expensive so my question is what kind of tire can i get for the least amount of money and how long will it last for me i would like to stay away from firestones i hear they are bad

lol

NE way... is there a place where i can post other tire questions that i have or should i start a new thread for this and other questions i cannot decide yet so i'll just start a new thread

lol

paulj
10-12-2004, 11:06 PM
gawd06 asked:

> What size tires do you run?

225/70/16; Goodyear Integritys (cheap, used minivan/Pilot stock tires)

> Do you have 4wd?

yes

> Have you ever taken your E off road in the mountains?

Never off road; but I have driven some rough roads. See my threads in the 'off roading' section, here and the hondaelement.org gallery.

> I would like a little more clearence with a new tire. I want to use the stock EX wheel. Can I get the 235/70/16 on those wheels saftely with clearence in the wheel wells and without hitting when turning or over bumps?

No one has reported hitting the wheel wells. With the stiff independent suspension, the tires don't seem to travel up very far. After the strut towers the next point that a tire might hit is a vertical protrusion at the rear of the wheel well.

I have discussed the issue of clearance elsewhere. More important than bigger tires (or skid plates) is experience. You want to drive over and around ruts and bumps in a way that maintains maximum clearance over the vulnerable parts of the car. I try to stay out of ruts, cross waterbars at an angle, avoid straddling rocks, etc. And when in doubt, I turn back - this is easy in the short Element.

> Have you changed your shocks or struts?
No. I don't recall any reports of replacement strut towers, only lowering kits.

> Will this size clear with the struts?
Clearing the struts is primary requirement when trying new tires. A tire with an aggressive shoulder tread may rub.

> It sounds like you know you stuff. Can you answer my questions?
yes

See the link that I just added to the 'Reviews and Fitment of Wheels/Tires that work on the Element' thread. People have reported good fit with tires like the Bridgestone A/T Revo in the 235/70/16 size.

My main qualm with going to a larger tire size is the issue of fitting chains. Chains are the ultimate answer if you need extra traction in a pinch. I have tested chains on the stock size, but not on the slightly larger ones that I now have.

paulj

ramblerdan
10-13-2004, 11:57 AM
Tire sizing codes make my head spin. Once I got the formula right (I hope!), I created an Excel file to see how various size codes correspond to total tire diameter, because total diameter affects not only "gearing," so to speak, but speedometer accuracy as well.

The chart on the left is sorted by rim diameter/tire width/aspect ratio. The one on the right is sorted by divergence from the diameter of OEM tire size (707.4 mm, or 27.9 inches).

Note that actual diameter for a given code may vary among manufacturers, models, and possibly even individual sizes.

Charts also available at http://www.skidmore.edu/~pdwyer/e/tire_charts.htm

Copies of the Excel file available at http://www.skidmore.edu/~pdwyer/e/files/tire_sizes.xls

Finally, I invite comments, and above all, corrections. If I got this wrong, I'll post a correction and updated info.

http://www.skidmore.edu/~pdwyer/e/images/tires_both.gif

FWIW, I think 205/75-16 might be an optimal size for E snow tires. It's about a half inch narrower than stock (snows should be a little narrow, all things considered) yet only 0.92% off in diameter, so no real worries on the speedo reading. What snows, if any, are available in that size I couldn't say.

biocube
10-13-2004, 12:12 PM
on the 215/75/16 line.

ramblerdan
10-13-2004, 12:35 PM
one error
on the 215/75/16 line.
Darn, you're quick.

Biocube was right, and the chart has been fixed.

paulj
10-13-2004, 12:37 PM
A problem with the 205/75/16 size is availability. Tirerack gave me 0 choices in this size. Tirerack doesn't carry every brand, but they have one of the largest selections around, so are a good indicator of what you will or will not find elsewhere.

If you want to go narrower than stock, 205/80/16 has 2 Tirerack choices. Its overall diameter is close to that of 235/70/16.

There are a number of choices in the 215/65/16 size, but most are intended for passenger cars, rather than SUV/light trucks. There is only one Tirerack choice in 215/75/16, but many in the 215/75/15, and even more in 235/75/15 (a popular pickup size).

http://rav4world.com/index/tirelist.html
is table of tire sizes compiled for the RAV4, which has the same stock size as the Element. Not only does it give the overall diameter, it also comments on fit, including examples. The sticky thread under 'performance' aims at providing a similar collection of examples.

A table that sorts first on rim size, and then on overall diameter would be more useful than one sorted only on oveerall diameter. Changing rim size is a much bigger step than changing tires while keeping the stock wheels. Once you consider alternative wheels you need to deal with brake clearance, offset, and rim width as well as rim diameter.

In 18" rims, there are almost no choices with a width less than 235. People choose large rims because they want wide low profile tires.

paulj

dblair
10-14-2004, 09:52 AM
Aside from the obvious size and to some extent tread pattern differences what is the differences between Light Truck/SUV tires and passenger car tires? Is it just load carrying capacity?

ramblerdan
10-14-2004, 10:10 AM
A table that sorts first on rim size, and then on overall diameter would be more useful than one sorted only on overall diameter.
Ask and ye shall receive. Second chart added.

Also note that all are free to download the Excel file, which can be sorted any way you like.

paulj
10-14-2004, 10:52 PM
[quote:3c063ded9c=" "]Aside from the obvious size and to some extent tread pattern differences what is the differences between Light Truck/SUV tires and passenger car tires? Is it just load carrying capacity?[/quote:3c063ded9c]

Most tire spec tables give a load capacity rating. With a few exceptions, this rating depends on size more than anything. A few models and sizes within those models will have a regular and higher load rating version. With commercial truck tires there are more variations in load rating (with different numbers of plys etc).

Some tire sizes are designated with a P or LT, but that appears to be mostly a remnant of earlier sizing traditions. Tirerack may have a article on that issue.

Anyways, for the sizes that work with the Element, the distinction between passenger and SUV tires is largely one of intended market, tread style and in some cases sidewall looks. Just as there is blending of the car types there is a blending of the tire types.

tirerack article on load ranges of passenger and light truck tires:
http://www.tirerack.com/tires/tiretech/lighttruck/loadrange.jsp


paulj

lars161
10-14-2004, 11:28 PM
http://www.discounttiredirect.com/direct/brochure/info/tmpInfoTireMathNS.jsp

paulj
10-15-2004, 02:19 AM
I looked up winter tire packages on Tirerack.com for the Element. They recomend either the stock size (215/70/16) on 16" wheels, or 215/75/15 on 15" wheels. They do talk elsewhere about narrower tires being better for snow, but there aren't many 205 width tires with a similar diameter. In terms of selection and price there isn't much of an advantage to going with the 15" wheels.

http://www.tirerack.com/snow/WinterPackageMain.jsp?autoMake=Honda&autoModel=Element+DX&autoYear=2003&autoModClar=4wd

denru
10-16-2004, 02:09 PM
Since I'm also thinking of replacing the stock Goodyears (finally) this is extremely useful information. Thanks! 8)

diverdon
10-17-2004, 12:11 AM
has anyone ever tried this size?? It looks like it is the closest to the same as stock as far as the speedo reading the same by the charts I have looked at .. Question is .....Will it fit ??? No Rubbing??!! AND is there reall such a size made ?? Thanks Don

paulj
10-17-2004, 12:51 AM
245/60/16 - none available from Tirerack

This is 30mm wider than stock. Feel between your front tire and the strut tower behind it. Is that space larger than 1.5 cm?

I think 235 is largest section width that people have moved to, with the stock rims. A 245 might also be too wide to fit on 6.5 width rim.

If you need to change rims, then you might as well move up in diameter as well - various people have showcased their Elements with larger diameter wheels and wide low profile tires.

paulj

Theelements
10-17-2004, 01:22 AM
just do a search on google

drphun
10-18-2004, 11:01 AM
FYI, the 215/65R16 tires are close and a lot more common than the 215/70's if you want something close to stock.

With respect to the table, I suppose that those are the theoretical dimentions. In reality there is variation and tires of the same indicated size from different manaufacturers are different diameters. (I have actually measured tires to determine this.)

Best wishes,

ramblerdan
11-17-2004, 11:48 PM
In reality there is variation and tires of the same indicated size from different manaufacturers are different diameters.
No question. And the diameter changes a bit with wear, as well.

paulj
11-18-2004, 12:52 AM
FYI, the 215/65R16 tires are close and a lot more common than the 215/70's if you want something close to stock.


215/65/16 drops the size down 3%; 235/60/16 is more like 2.6%.

Looking on Tirerack there is indeed a large selection of tires in the 215/65 size, but most are in the passenger car categories (grand touring, etc). The selection in the SUV 'highway all season' category appears to be about the same as for the stock size. If I were to switch to a 'performance' tire, I'd choose 235/60/16 over 215/65/16, with a lower profile and a bit closer diameter.

paulj