I have posted this before but never on the "Asl Honda" board...I never saw this here actually.

I have a Honda that is two months old w/ about 6,000 miles on it. The breaks grind VERY LOUD in the morning, which can be normal. However, they do tend to grind throught the day if you listen for it.

Is this covered uner the warranty?

I bought my 04 EX with 13,700 miles and the brakes ground all the time. I took it back to my dealer who had all 4 rotors turned and 8 new pads installed and there is no noise any time now. I'll have to wait and see if it returns.

I have posted this before but never on the "Asl Honda" board...I never saw this here actually.

I have a Honda that is two months old w/ about 6,000 miles on it. The breaks grind VERY LOUD in the morning, which can be normal. However, they do tend to grind throught the day if you listen for it.

Is this covered uner the warranty?

i had the same problem and now have the same problem again after having them fixed.. one of my earlier post..
I now have 45000 miles and my rear brakes have problems again, only 15,000 miles this time. The first set went at around 30,000. The rear pads and rotors were replaced by the dealer then. Now i was having noise coming from the rear wheels and while i was having the dealer install a wiring harness i had them check the brakes. They informed me that I had a broken spring clamp and that the pads were wearing unevenly. They said the rotors will probably be have to be turned also. I had them change the broken clamp and i talked to my mechanic this evening. I have decided to deal with the noise and go as long as i can until i really need to change the pads and rotors. I have my regular mechanic inspect and clean my brakes when i rotate tires so this sucks.

My dealer did cover them at 30,000. They wouldnt cover them at 45,000 cuz the rotors werent that bad. After I bought my E i learned quickly why the sound system was so good. Good luck.

Your brake rotors rust at night. In the morning when you start to drive and step on the brakes for the first time the pads are scraping off the rust.
It is very noticable in the Element.

What "breaks" are you referring to? Is it possible you meant "brakes"? hee hee

I too experience a bit of grinding after sitting, and that is quite normal due to the surface rust that accumulates on the disc. Just a few applications of the "brakes" and it's gone.

Just turn up the awesome stereo and it's all better.

update on my brakes from my post earlier on this thread...it might be normal when you first use your brakes in the morning but not when you hear noise from the rear brakes all the time. Now at 50,000 when i was at the meet on the way to the East Liberty plant my rear brakes went again. Metal to metal. I talked with several of the honda reps and 2 people who created the E and they couldnt understand the situation of my rear brakes. They explained like 70 percent of the braking is done on the front brakes and they usually go first. They told me to go back to my local dealer and tell them what they told me and request them to get honda to fix them correctly. So i called my dealer on monday and explained the situation. The service manager said he would have to make a few phone calls and call me back. Well, it is now thursday and i didnt receive a call back from my dealer so i decided to call him and find out what honda had to say. When he answered he needed all my info again and had to look it up on the computer and seemed not wanting to help me. He told me that they now would have to check the brakes out and that with 50,000 miles honda wouldnt cover them. Why didnt he tell me on monday that they needed me to make an appointment or call me back. More less trying to get me to drop the issue, because he didnt want to deal with it. I ASKED him if i needed to call the regional rep. and get them involved and he told me to do what i had to ( in a tone that wasnt professional). I was very polite and calm as i was advised to be by the people from the plant. So i said then when can i make an appointment, he told me to hold on and i was now transferred to another person. I have an appointment a week from this friday. After i got off the phone i decided to call honda and make a request for some involvement from the regional rep. The lady was polite on the phone and i now have a case number and that the regional rep will be in touch with me in 2 to 3 business days. The rep will be contacting the dealer first. I will keep you guys posted on what the outcome is. Wish me luck.

i am now sitting at my local dealer waiting for them to tell me what they are going to do regarding my brakes. What they told me when i gave them my keys doesnt look good, but you never know. I will defintely post later this afternoon the results. The way it looks right now is that if you live where you get winter weather then you better have your brakes cleaned and lubed every 7000 to 10000 miles. That is what they told me already. Wish me some luck!

well they arent going to cover the rear brakes. they blamed it on improper cleaning due to dirt build up and stated that the E brakes need to be cleaned and lubed every 7000 to 10000 miles. I declined at first for them to fix them due to their price. As a waited for them to move my E outside the manager came up and offered for them to cover the rotors. Its all a game because of the markup they had the first price they offered but i decided to have them done now due to the right rear pad is completely gone and that i was already here. The advise i can give from my experience to any of my fellow E owners is that to make sure you have your rear brakes cleaned every 10,000 miles. The only thing now is that i better not have an abnormal noise coming from the brakes when I leave the dealership.

Craig, email TMac and ask him for someone to contact at Honda. This is not right. Where in the ENTIRE Honda Warranty/Service booklet does it ever, ever, ever mentioning lubing the rear brakes??? It DOESN'T!!!! I have never in my life heard of having to lube brakes before. That is the most a$$inine thing I have ever heard before. I have 30,900 miles and don't have the issues you are having with your brakes. I have gone through a ton of snow and road salt and don't have these issues. Your dealer is pulling more than your leg. Next time ask them to at least give you a kiss when screwing you over this bad.

I would fight with them some more. Make certain to get the parts and keep them. Also, make certain to get it in writing that their repair work is good for 1 year/12,000 miles which is supposed to be what the warranty is on repairs and parts.

Good luck and keep us posted.

i hear you larry, i had already contacted Honda and they had already contacted the dealer prior to my arrival. I just spent $190 on my rear brakes which better last more than the 25,000 to 40000 miles they told me they would last. I ended up paying for the pads and labor for both installed. All i have to say is that i am NOT a happy Honda owner right now! Two sets of rear brakes in 50,000 miles, what a joke!

You paid $190?????? for them to install rear brake pads???? Craig, you have lived up in the mountains far too long. You are talking a 30 minute labor charge MAX... if they want to be a bunch of pricks they can charge you an hour, what is that... $55-65/hour? The rear brake pads can't cost more than at the most $50... you got SCREWED big time. :(

i knew before hand the honda rear pads were around $50 and the rotors were $70 each. According to majestic pricing. So i figured that i paid for the parts. They charge $70 an hour for labor. They charged 1.5 hours to do them.

i just received a phone call from america honda today about my brake situation . I told him the whole story about my brakes and so on. He told me they have nothiing in their database about rear brake problems and there is no service bulletins. He told me he was sending me a letter that i can take to a dealer and have a free complete service. What every that is. So now when i hit 7500 miles on my new brakes and i will use my free service so they can inspect, clean, and lube my brakes. As i stated before make sure you keep all the receipts from any shop that you have done work on your E, so if you have a problem you have proof hat was done.

well, i have found some info on this interesting brake issue. My buddies parents own an Element (due to me showing them mine), that also had rear brake problems. Their rear rotors and pads were replaced at 18,000 under warranty by the same dealer that i went too. The dealer used the same reasons they gave me about dirt buildup. Same old bs. I have a copy of their invoice when the work was done so when i call the guy from America Honda tomorrow I can give him the information. I want to also see what he has to say about this, since he told me they had nothing in their database about rear brake problem. I will post more after i talk to him.

my last thoughts on this matter unless something big happens. I called the America honda rep today and told him about my friends parentsh having their rear brakes done at 18000 miles. He basically didnt want to hear it and i got the impression that they DEFINETLY dont like customers they are informed and willing to speak up when something is wrong. So everyone just make sure you have those rear brakes checked often, especially while it is under warranty.

that is very depressing i have 3400 miles on my E and the brake pedals vibrates/grinds the last few feet before a stop. should i take it in?

that is very depressing i have 3400 miles on my E and the brake pedals vibrates/grinds the last few feet before a stop. should i take it in?

yes, take it in and get it checked. The biggest thing is to make sure there is a record of you reporting a problem. Even if they cant find one and say that it is dirt build up. That is the common line. Good luck!

ill take her in :-)

wow dude that is just insane they way they treated you. as someone else stated no where in the book does it say to have your rear brakes cleaned and lubed.

I would also call the BBB and post everywhere this issue you are having with them.


good luck man!

I just had my rear brakes totally redone at the dealer's cost. I moved back to Florida this past May after graduating college in NJ. About two months in to being here in the sunshine state, my Element started whirring. Then making a grinding noise like I was driving with my Emergency brake on.

I brought it to the dealer and the service tech drew me a picture of a warped rotor and how snow can cause such things. Yah ok buddy. Then every person who's ever driven in snow up north then moved down here would have a really obnoxiously loud car. I asked if I needed to do anything about this- and he told me naaaaaaah, your brakes look great, get them redone according to the manual's standards.

3 months later the noise got to the point that passengers in other cars would give me dirty looks. I took it back to the dealership, and my previous service writer has since been fired (imagine that).

My new guy panicked when he heard the noise and in general conversation he asks, "How much driving do you do a day?" I replied about 90 miles per day. Luckily I haven't needed to stop short- as I found out later that afternoon.

I apparently had no brakes what so ever left. My calipers and pistons were locked, which caused the warping in the first place.

My Service Writer called to tell me that I had full metal on metal and needed a brake replacement in the rear. And started to quote me prices. I went in to damage control mode- And mentioned to him that they told me my brakes were fine, how can I have brake failure at 17,000 miles? and 3 months prior they were super? I asked him if there is a warped rotor, isn't your recommendation to replace it pronto to spare the brake system (I talked to other mechanics to find that out).

Within the hour the dealership called me back, and said they were covering everything. That it was a manufacturer defect.

People fight the system!!!

Yes you should clean and lube them every 7000. I dont know of anyone that does tho.
I had the same thing on my CR-V at 30,000. I have replaced everything (except the calipers).

I did the job myself. Put on Akebono Proact ceramic pads and new Brimbo replacement rotors. The thing stops much faster than B-4 and is quieter with no brake DUST on the wheels.

I will do the same to the E when it needs them !!!!

I just went thru this issue at 33k RT Rear rotor had a gouge and made a grinding noise. Took to Commonwealth Honda in Lawrence MA.

On the plus side they took me right away and fixed in 2 hrs. Rear rt rotor shot. They picked up the pads and 2 rotors as they apparently need to be changed in pairs I paid for the labor 192.00

I called honda HQ and am waiting for their side of the story, but it looks like Honda feels that pads rotors are a non covered item at only 33k. I think the moral to the story is dont stick a truck on a civic chassis.

I got the same song and dance about cleaning and adjusting brakes every 12k?

Will advise on outcome. The phrase Hanger Queen comes to mind and its sad as the E is a very practical car.

.. as someone else stated no where in the book does it say to have your rear brakes cleaned and lubed.
'The book" does say "inspect brake system," if during inspection they are found to be dirty or sticking they should be properly cleaned and lubed.

Brakes need to be serviced/maintained!

In some areas, especially where there is lots of dust/dirt/road salt it is required more frequently. Some vehicles are more prone to corrosion/sticking caliper problems than others.

If you're in an area where they use lotsa road salt I recomend you service the brakes every spring... when you switch out the winter tires, or rotate your regular ones.

Will

I know it sucks, but it is important to have your brakes serviced at regular intervals. The rear pads sit in shims on the rear mounting bracket.
If you drive through salt, gravel or snow, corrosion will build up on the shims and the pads. This corrosion will cause the pads to seize - the caliper piston can push the pads to apply the brakes, but when the piston retracts, the pads don't back off, and the result is brakes that are dragging, obviously resulting in premature wear.
The Element, CR-V and Accord share the same rear brake set up.
As a Honda Tech, I have seen many vehicles where I had to remove the pads with a hammer and chisel.
You must remove the pads and the shims - clean all surfaces and apply a thin film of silicone brake grease. The pads should slide on the shims without sticking. Also pull out the slide pins from the mounting bracket and give them a thin coat of silicone grease as well.
This service should be performed every 16,000 kms (10,000 miles?)
(or sooner if road conditions are consistently bad)
The owners maintinance book recommends services - type 1(A) - oil change, type 2(B) add brake service, tire rotation, inspection , type 3(C) - add more lengthy inspection and type 4(D) - add cabin filter, air filter and more thorough inspection.
(I personally inspect ALL vehicles that I get on my hoist - good for me to find needed repairs, good for the owner to know the condition of their vehicle)
It is unfortunate your dealer conducted themselves in such a poor manner - too quick to be defensive and obviously poor people skills.
I would look for either another dealer with better service, or a better service writer at the dealership you go to.
The people you deal with make a huge difference in having a good or bad experience.
Barry B

Honda will not do anything for me on my rear brakes. Said "its not our job to have you read the manual"

wow

buried on page 164 166 and I mean buried.

wow

inspect brakes

maybe in the next manual they could say "If you dont lube your pads every 10k we will not warranty your brakes" Of course Honda could go back to making good cars and standing behind what they sell, but why bother, who actually competes with them. I think they have a case of top dog syndrome.

I'm the first to criticize Honda for claiming that "driving on muddy, dusty, or de-iced roads"—i.e., living in the northern half of the U.S. or anywhere in Canada—constitutes "severe" usage, but I can't fault them for wanting the brakes inspected every 10,000 miles. Even the normal maintenance schedule calls for brake inspection at 20,000 miles. Whoever did your 20K (and let's also say 10K and 30K) service should have inspected the brakes and corrected the problem before it caused premature wear. Not trying to pick a fight here, but if you did the service yourself, or if you didn't have the car serviced at 10K, 20K and 30K, then you have learned an expensive lesson.

OK people I know we all love our Element but if we all need to come to terms with two major issues the Element has. The first being the windshield design (IMHO too upright and too thin glass quality) And the second the brakes. The Element is a 20K car not a Lambougini. Having to service your brakes every 7k,10k or even 20k is bad design. Period. I have a 2004 that has had constant brake issues. The most common complaint you hear about is the calipers sticking.And most people by the time they hear the grinding have gone through the pads and alot of things replaced because the Elements warning system(scraper bars) are useless. We should not have to have our brakes and rotors replaced at 25k. In comparison I had a Toyota Tacoma that I drove for 65K before I started to hear a slight scraping noice and it just need new pads!. We all know it and aren't willing to admit it that there is a major design problem with the Elements brakes. I don't drive like a mad man, I live in the north with winter weather(NO EXCUSE HONDA) but I never, ever owned a car with as much brake problems as the Element.

I've read a lot of the posts (great feedback and great info) on the Element brakes and it looks like I need to stay on top of the maintenance. I'm willing to do this because I love my Element. It does everything I need it to do. I have a 2004 EX model and am wondering if anyone with a newer model, say a 2007, is having the same brake issues? Did Honda make a change to improve the wear problems on the brakes? I'm willing to trade in my 2004 on a newer model if there have been improvements and/or less problems with the brakes. If not I guess I'll keep my 2004 and deal with the maintenance.

Anybody had experience using anti-sieze compound instead of brake grease on the Element? That's what I use on my 1987 Nissan pickup brakes, it seems to hold up longer than grease.

Anybody had experience using anti-sieze compound instead of brake grease on the Element? That's what I use on my 1987 Nissan pickup brakes, it seems to hold up longer than grease.

On the movement points of disc brakes, or drums? I've used silver anti-seize on drum brake components like adjusters, but I've always used caliper grease on discs.

I've always had good luck w/ brake/caliper grease. Not just grease, but brake grease.
http://www.crcindustries.com/auto/images/literature/Syn.-Brake-&-Caliper-Grease.jpg
Synthetic Brake & Caliper Grease (http://www.crcindustries.com/files/Syn.%20Brake%20Caliper%20Grease.pdf)

It is special stuff for a special job. :wink:


My brake maintenance ain't all that complicated:

I try to spray water from the hose inside the wheel and rinse off the calipers real good when I wash the car, especially in the winter (road salt).

I clean the calipers real good w/ soap and water and a brush and rinse well when I rotate the tires. (every 10k miles or so) I take a very carefull look at them for wear at the same time. I'll disassemble and lube at this time if I haven't do it in the last year or so. This is my version of the "brake inspection" that Honda recomends. "Looking & cleaning" adds 15min to my tire rotation, "dissasembly & lube" maybe an additional 20min. I'll "strech" or adjust my tire rotation to late April or May, so I can get 'em clean after the winter.

They get disassembled and lubed at least every 2-3 years when I replace the brake fluid.

Nothing fancy, and only a little bit of extra effort and time if combined w/ tire rotation or similar service.

Good luck.

Will