This is a work in progress but I believe it is accurate. If I've mis-labeled something or left something out - please let me know. This diagram is a work in progress not a bible. :D

The main goal of this integration diagram is to show how an aftermarket head unit with RCA pre-outs, non fading subwoofer control, and an aux source can be fully integrated with the Element EX factory amplifier, subwoofer, speakers, and AUX jack without any special integration equipment such as line level converters, etc. All you need is some male RCA jacks and some patience.

Lastly, please be aware that the image below is considered intellectual property and should not be downloaded for the purposes of posting elsewhere or linked to elsewhere on the Internet. Thanks for your cooperation. :D

http://home.comcast.net/~derek-kelly/element/audio/eaudint.jpg

Just for reference - the following diagram will give you an idea of what the wiring on the back of an aftermarket head unit might look like. If the head unit below had an AUX source and non fading subwoofer control you'd see 2 additional pairs of rca pre outs...

http://www.eatel.net/~stentorian/elecdisc/ashdclos.gif

eMass you rock.

Thanks for this post, it'll make things a LOT easier!

Thanks for the diagrams.

I have 2 questions.

1) I am using the metra 70-1721 harness adapter, but it DOES NOT have the Amplifier Turn on wire. Is the amp auto powered when there is a signal? There are only 14 wires coming, not 15 like in the diagram.

2) I have a left and right subwoofer RCA input on my head unit. How I connect it to the mono-subwoofer inputs? (just the left?)

:?: :?: :?:

edit: one more question

3) Does the PAC RCA to Line Level Adapter go in between the speaker +/- and the RCA plugs on the left side of the diagram?

1. The Power Antenna lead is also the Amplifier Turn On. I had the same problem where the speakers came on only when I was in Tuner mode. I then connected the Element's Power Antenna to the Amplifier Turn On of my new head unit.

2. You mean left and right subwoofer OUTPUT right? I just connected mine to the left and seems to be working fine.

System:
Clarion ProAudio VRX935VD DVD/MP3 Receiver/7" LCD Monitor (sound processor under driver's seat)
Infinity Kappa 6.1 components (rear)
Rockford Fosgate Punch 801X 4 Channel Amplifier (under driver's side rear seat)
Existing Element's Front speakers and subwoofer.

Mike

eMass,

Do you happen to know if the OEM unit has a mute-wire?

-brendan

emass -

Three areas of concern:

1. The picture of the Metra 70-1721 on your diagram doesn't match mine. Is that the same part, or not?

Other than it being black (mine's white), the harness having an outer positive locking assembly (mine doesn't), it seems like the business end is exactly the same, but the wiring indicates it was *mirror image* flipped (like someone imaged a negative that was layed down on the wrong side).

Also, mine seems to be missing the amplifier turn on wire, all the rest are there. Is that needed?

2. The subwoofer (red/blue, red/white) cables: are those on the same harness, or elsewhere?

3. Related: on element-j's headunit page (http://www.re-vision.com/element-j/head_unit.html), the blue plug is what we connect the 70-1721 into, yes? The white/black plug is, I assume, the aux socket plug, yes? But what's the green plug for??? Wait a sec, it matches the color of the socket at the amp. ugh, i think my assumptions are all wrong. :(

thanks for any help you can give...

-brendan

The pictures are for illustration only and do not represent the actual harnesses. The wiring diagram colors should match the diagram although it's always safer to match the functions - not the colors.

I believe he amplifier turn on wire for the Element is actually the antenna lead. If there's nothing to conenct the amp turn on to then don't.

The subwoofer cables should be on the same harness.

The harness plugs are all keyed so that you can't plug something else into it. It will all be much clearer to you when you take things apart and look at them although the guide above is no substitute for professional assistance from your local car stereo shop! :)

The pictures are for illustration only and do not represent the actual harnesses. The wiring diagram colors should match the diagram although it's always safer to match the functions - not the colors.

Ok, good.

I believe he amplifier turn on wire for the Element is actually the antenna lead. If there's nothing to conenct the amp turn on to then don't.

Ok, I'll keep that in mind, and be prepared to do some last minute rewiring for that at the car.

The subwoofer cables should be on the same harness.

Oh. Huh. The 70-1721 I have doesn't have enough wires to carry a separate subwoofer channel. Great.

The harness plugs are all keyed so that you can't plug something else into it. It will all be much clearer to you when you take things apart and look at them although the guide above is no substitute for professional assistance from your local car stereo shop! :)

Ok, no guarantee, I understand. :)

One last question:

What's the green plug going into the stock EX headunit shown on Element-J's site? The larger white one is what I plug the 70-1721 into. I assumed the smaller white was the aux-in connector. That still leaves a bunch of leads on the green connector un-accounted for...

thanks again, emass,
-brendan

u got a stock amp wiring diagram?

Yeah, I've got the service manual now. You want the wiring of the stock amp sitting in the passenger side kickpanel, right?

-brendan

Otherwise, take note that line level is the opposite of speaker level. Line level means an UNamplified signal sent over RCA cables at typically 1.5 to 7 volts.

Some of the posts here regarding 'line level' will have certainly confused audio novices...

Agreed...for the most part. I *think* most consumer line level signals are supposed to peak at up to 2V, though some peak lower (I've read that 0.3V is the minimum to be considered line level and not mic or amplified mic level).

However, *some* pro and/or pro-sumer line level outs are advertised to go up to 4V or 6V peaks. Typically these "line-level plus" outputs are used to fight noise interference in long cable runs to an amp.

And standard in-car speaker levels tends to peak at or above 20V (I think I read somewhere that 20V is typical for a 50W speaker). More if you're putting in high power stuff.

Then there's the stuff about input impedance and output impedance, which I don't have my head wrapped around yet.

But let's agree: "line level" is the voltage level typically seen on a) RCA stereo connectors, b) the line-in expected by an outboard amp and therefore generated by devices providing signal to an amp and finally, c) approximately the level given by the headphone outputs of a portable CD or MP3 player connected to an aux-in jack, provided that it's volume control is adjusted such that the loudness of the portable matches the loudness of the in-dash radio/cd-player when playing other material. :)

-brendan

Let me put this to bed since there seems to be alot of confusion about "speaker line level" vs. "preamp" outputs...

Many aftermarket car stereo head units have 2 different types of outputs.

One type of output (the preamp output) is designed to drive the preamp level input of an amplifier, crossover or equalizer. Preamp level outputs do not have enough output current to allow them to drive speakers directly. They are generally included on higher end equipment. In virtually all cases, they will have RCA type connectors. Some units will have only one set of preamp outputs while others might have multiple pairs of outputs for front, rear and subwoofer signals.

The other type of output (speaker line level output) is designed to drive a set of speakers directly and may also be (far less commonly) used to drive the audio input of an amplifier.

The main difference between the preamp signal and the speaker output signal is the current capability of the signal.

The preamp level signal is a very low noise, low current output. The speaker output signal is capable of supplying much more current than the preamp output signal.

The output voltage levels from the preamp outputs and speaker outputs MAY be approximately the same but the speaker drive voltage is usually higher. When the volume is low, the voltage out is low.

To increase the volume, you must increase the output voltage. You are controlling the output voltage level when you set the volume level.

Also, you can convert line level signals into preamp type signals. If you have a stock head unit and don't want to replace it, you'll likely need to use a Line Output Converter (LOC). This is a small box with line level wires on one end and RCA preamp outputs on the other with an adjustable gain dial on board. These units will convert the speaker level signal to a preamp level signal.

Maybe the best way for people to think about preamp vs. line level outputs is the terminology "high" and "low". Think high level output when you're talking about speaker line level leads and think low when talking about RCA style preamp leads.

Hope this helps! :D

Difficulty: If you have installed a few car stereo's in your life, this should be fairly self explanatory. If you are a novice to wiring, this might seem a little overwhelming. This modification does require a bit of work, but you will have a much cleaner, crisper sound with the results. If you have any questions about this, ask them BEFORE you attempt to do this.



After installing aftermarket headunits, a few people have asked how to bypass the stock amp that way they wont have to run new wire throughout the Element to the door and dash speakers to avoid distortion.

If you dont already know, the stock amp is located behind the passenger side kick panel. If you are sitting in the passenger seat, this is the plastic floor-panel on the right side of your right foot.(under the glovebox).

Remove this panel:

http://sier_element.home.comcast.net/kickpanel.gif


You will want to pull on this piece from the front - meaning the side that is up by the engine - and pull the panel away from passenger-side wall. Then you will see your stock amp, laughing at you for the distortion it has caused.

####### This section can be difficult, but makes things easier in the long run######

Remove the two bottom screws on the amp. There is a third nut on the top that is on a 2 inch bolt that is attached to the Element. This nut will be pretty difficult to remove without a socket wrench and a DEEP socket. I ended up winding my hand in there and using a pair of pliers to loosen up the bolt and untightened it by hand. If you dont want to remove this screw, you can still complete the bypass


######EDIT#######
I believe you can access the top screw if you pop the glovebox out. It's super easy to do. Here's a diagram on how to remove the clips in the glovebox. Make sure its empty, because it flips upsidedown:

http://sier_element.home.comcast.net/glovebox.gif

################################################## ###########

If you removed the amp, the next section will be a snap. If not, you will have to do a few things first.

There is a black plastic sleeve (with clips) that fits over the wires leading to and from the amp that is attached to the side of the amp. You can completely remove this sleeve for easier access, but it is not needed if you removed the amp.

If you have removed the amp, take out the two plugs on the top.

If you have not removed the amp, feel around on the top of the amp and you will feel two plugs. In the center of each plug is a "release" tab (just like on the wire harness of a stereo). Press this center in and tug upwards to release the plug. Repeat with the other plug.

If you dont have enough slack on these plugs, you might have to release the clips on the black plastic sleeve that covers them (on the side of the amp...this will make sense when you are looking at it). Once the wires are free of that sleeve you should have more than enough room to do your splicing.

You'll notice that the wires leading into the amp are the same as the color configuration coming from the wire harness like this diagram:

http://home.comcast.net/~derek-kelly/element/audio/eaudint.jpg
(thanks to emass for that wiring diagram)

All you need to pay attention to are the colors of the front and rear spearkers (both positive and negative). Here are the front and rear colors of the speaker wires that come from the stereo:

amp input speaker wiring color codes (all line level - comes from deck):

front left + = white
front left - = orange
front right + = yellow
front right - = brown
rear left + = red
rear left - = green
rear right + = blue
rear right - = black

You'll notice one of the plugs that came out of the amp has all of these colored wires leading to it. This is the set of wires coming from the headunit.

Cut the wires that correspond to the speakers (listed above). This will stop the signal from going into the stock amplifier. Now, cut the following wires on the other plug:

amp output speaker wiring color codes (speaker level - goes to speakers):

front left + = green/black stripe
front left - = green
front right + = green/yellow stripe
front right - = blue/yellow stripe
rear left + = blue/white stripe
rear left - = blue/black stripe
rear right + = pink
rear right - = blue/yellow stripe

These are the wires that lead out of the amp and to the door and dash speakers. Now, all you have to do is simply connect each wire to its counterpart.


Moderator's Note: wiring codes corrected 7/12/06

These are how the wires should be connected when bypassing the amp.

front left + = white > green/black stripe
front left - = orange > green
front right + = yellow > green/yellow stripe
front right - = brown > blue/yellow stripe
rear left + = red > blue/white stripe
rear left - = green > blue/black stripe
rear right + = blue > pink
rear right - = black > blue/yellow stripe

Here is a picture of my wires before I crimped them. I would recommend crimping all the wires together, but electrical tape will work just fine.

http://img.villagephotos.com/p/2005-1/940070/wires.jpg

And here is a diagram of how the wires line up with eachother when bypassing the stock amp.

You might notice that there are two blue wires with yellows stripes. To determine which is which, just look at the wire right next to it in the plug, and it will be the positive or negative counter-part. Then refer back to this list to see which blue wire with a yellow stripe you are dealing with based on its counterpart. Hope that helps.

http://img.villagephotos.com/p/2005-1/940070/E-WIRE1.jpg


If anyone has any questions, feel free to comment away.


Moderator's Note: wiring codes corrected 7/12/06

Does anyone have a diagram showing the stock setup? I see alot of discussions on this boars about what works and doesnt work, and its all very confusing.

Forgive me if this sounds like I'm bringing up an old topic, but I searched high and low and read, I thought, every relevant thread.

Can someone clue me in to exactly _where_ the tweeter's wiring connects to the amp? Or do they?

I put in some infinity components, but for the life of me I can't figure out how/where the tweet wires run to.

also, if relevant, why are there FOUR speaker wires on the driver's door?

Also see http://www.elementownersclub.com/forums/showthread.php?t=10833

ok, thanks. but I've read through those post like a gazillion times and I still don't see where the wiring from the tweeters connects to everything else.

(please see attached lame diagram, and fill in the missing connection, if you can)

this is a major pain in the ass job, and this thread should be sticky. it'd be cool if someone posted the secret to getting the kick panel off without breaking it (like I did). the whole procedure of bypassing the amp and installing a new head unit that works with the sub is not a job for the faint of heart. just wanted to throw that out there. i'm in the middle of it now, and it's really cool that people have made the whole process do-able, but it seems like getting a professional to do it would've been smarter. i'm upset that i broke that kick panel and scratched a couple other things. it's really tough not to. oh well, hopefully i'll finish today and it'll all work!

In regards to removing the kick panel - I just grabbed the side that was up towards the engine and pulled it back towards the back of the car and away from the wall. It has a lip that fits under the lower door trim (the part that gets scratched easily from getting in and out).

If you damaged your kick panel beyond repair, you can find the replacement part here:

http://www.hondaautomotiveparts.com/auto/jsp/mws/catdisplay.jsp?inputstate=2&catcgry1=Element&catcgry2=2004

That website will sell you any part. If you cant find it in the list, just send them an email and they will contact you within a day. I cant imagine that piece is anything more than 10-12 dollars.

This is a bit of work, you are correct. It would probably be easier to just have someone else do it, but this is a DIY version of what those professionals are going to be doing (if they dont run new wire). All in all, if you have super high-end components, you are going to want to run separate new wire to all your speakers and THAT can be a super pain. But this FAQ does deserve some sort of a "how hard on a 1 out of 10 scale is this?" sort of clarification. I hope all goes well for you on your install. Let us know how it works out =]

### EDIT ###
I added a "How to remove the Kick Panel" section to the instructions.

Sier, you're seriously the man. the help you're providing really goes above and beyond. thanks for the link.

my install is... going :roll:

my front let speakers aren't working, and i think the problem must be with the amp bypass wiring because the HU's wiring seemed fine. also, the Alpine AUX-in adapter i got doesn't seem to register as plugged-in. dunno what's going on there. i'll try again tomorrow. it's cold and raining here in Boston, as well as dark, so i gave it up for the night.

Wow! Excellent post. Just when my next mod is the sound system. Thanks!

Im installing a carpc and would like to tap into the wiring harness right after the amplifier. Is there a wring adapter that i can buy? If not, does anyone have the wire diagram, with polarity?

Did all trims of the element come with the amp? If not, did they run a different wire harness? I'm curious if honda created a bypass for the amp were they simply plugged in both the in and out of the amp into a wired connector.

You are the best just save me like 6 hrs of work for my Black E "My Box" on my audio install .....i will keep you posted on the install again nice post .....should be a sticky

I have just taken out the factory head unit but I do not see a conventional antenna. I have read everywhere and no one states that I need an antenna adapter.

Any help would be appreciated.

Yep, you'll need an adapter because the new Honda HUs have FAKRA connectors on them. Click the smilie for the adapter>>> :grin: (http://www.installer-data.com/item/display_item.php?it=40-hd10)

This adapter is necessary for '05 and '06 Elements since they added XM Radio as a standard item. I'm adding this thread to the wiring sticky as it should be there.

Cool move on the smiley, James. I've never seen that before. Simple, too. I'm going to steal that one. :)

My element was built in 06/05 so I technically might have an 06 headunit. I thought the 05 headunits did not need an adapter. Thanks for the help!!!

7/12/06: Corrected the wiring codes in sier's two posts. They were wrong.

Here are all the corrected codes, plus more, in a nutshell:

amp input speaker wiring color codes (all line level - comes from deck):

front left + = white
front left - = orange
front right + = yellow
front right - = brown
rear left + = red
rear left - = green
rear right + = blue
rear right - = black
subwoofer + = red/blue stripe
subwoofer - = red/white stripe

amp turn on wire (switched by radio) = yellow/green stripe

All of these above wires are found on the smaller green plug that goes into the amp. On the white plug that connects to the amp you will find:

constant power = blue/orange stripe
ground = black

plus

amp output speaker wiring color codes (speaker level - goes to speakers):

front left + = green/black stripe
front left - = green
front right + = green/yellow stripe
front right - = blue/yellow stripe
rear left + = blue/white stripe
rear left - = blue/black stripe
rear right + = pink
rear right - = blue/yellow stripe
subwoofer voice coil 1 + = brown
subwoofer voice coil 1 - = red
subwoofer voice coil 2 + = blue
subwoofer voice coil 2 - = grey/black stripe


This would mean, for the amplifier bypass, these would be the connections you'd want to make are:

front left + = white > green/black stripe
front left - = orange > green
front right + = yellow > green/yellow stripe
front right - = brown > blue/yellow stripe
rear left + = red > blue/white stripe
rear left - = green > blue/black stripe
rear right + = blue > pink
rear right - = black > blue/yellow stripe

Heres what I got, when I used the information on this thread!!! Whatcha think of my new head?!? that didnt sound quite right.............:evil:

does any one know which wires to splice into in the back of the stock head unit to hook up a rca low out adapter? i can't figure out which ones are the speaker wires. i got a "schematic" from my audio shop who wants 50 dollars to install it, but none of the wires on the diagram are in any of the 3 harness'. any help would be appreciated.
thanks in adavance.
adam

Welcome to the EOC, xardumx. My name is Gregg and I'm the Mobile Electronics moderator.

Use the wiring diagram developed by eMass above. It should have everything you need. You can also find this in a sticky at the top of the forum. Most of the connections are on the main plug. The subwoofer connections are on a separate plug, as are the AUX wires.

You shouldn't need an RCA line output adapter. The factory deck is already a line out level, about 1 volt. The signal doesn't get up to speaker level until after the factory amp which is behind your right kick panel.

thanks outpost. i have one question however. how would i get a signal to the amp for additional subwoofers without a rca? or am i not understanding something...

wire an rca plug on the line out from the head unit. if you cut open an existing rca cable, you'll see that there is a live wire in the middle and then shielding around it. the shielding is the ground and the middle wire is the positive. Its been a while since i did that, but i do believe i'm right.

there in lies my problem/question. if there is already a line out, which wires are they among all the other ones, or at least which are the speaker wires?

also i didn't find a remote wire. if it's there, i saw no white and blue or even blue wire.

The red/blue and red/white wires shown in eMass' diagram are the wires you need for hooking up any additional subwoofers. JP is correct. Just splice an RCA plug onto these wires in addition to having them go to the factory amp. That will get you the sub out from your deck so you can then run to a second deck.

Your remote turn on wire is a yellow wire with a green stripe that's on the main deck plug. Splice into that, too, and run it to your second amp. Most of the color coding on eMass' diagram, including the blue and blue/white wires, are for the Metra adapters, not Honda's wiring codes. The ones for the AUX jack and the subwoofer hook-ups are the Honda color codes. Here are the other color codes for the wires on the main plug coming out of your factory radio:

accessory power = yellow/red
constant power = white/red
ground = black
remote turn on = yellow/green
front left + = white
front left - = orange
front right + = yellow
front right - = brown
rear left + = red
rear left - = green
rear right + = blue
rear right - = black
shield = light green/black
lights on signal = red/black
dash lights brightness controller = red

thank you so much outpost.

Ok, reviving an old thread here, but I'm replacing my HU very soon and have a couple questions concerning the stock amp.

Does the stock amp have a built in crossover for the front component speakers?

..and do I need to get the PAC unit that emass discussed in another thread, to maintain control of the stock subwoofer? The reason for this question is I believe he mentioned RCA connections in one thread, then mentioned splicing RCAs in another....which is it? :twisted:

just trying to get the horse back in front of the cart with this install and make it as painless as possible. Any help is appreciated.:-D

Ok so I'm mulling around at work and decide to look up

"Honda Element ex, Amplifier By pass"

I found this thing:

http://www.installer.com/item/display_item.php?it=70-1726

It looks like you unplug the speaker connection ont he amp and then plug this in.

I'm hoping so. Have any of you seen this do hiki?8)

Ok, so I've read that if you install a new headunit through the preamp output, then the stock amp gets overloaded and is rendered useless thus no bass through the subwoofer (well it's very low). So I'm wondering if I do this setup, will the subwoofer sound normal again? Since I am bypassing the door speakers, the only thing the stock amp is being fed from the headunit through line-level is the subwoofer output meaning the amp isn't being overloaded.

Ok, so I've read that if you install a new headunit through the preamp output, then the stock amp gets overloaded and is rendered useless thus no bass through the subwoofer (well it's very low).
..almost... connecting your HU via the pre-amp outputs would mean you connected it through the RCA connections on the HU and are then sending a line-level signal to the amp. This is the CORRECT wiring for the stock amp. However, connecting the HU via a harness, sends a speaker-level signal to the amp..and this represents the situation you mention.

So I'm wondering if I do this setup, will the subwoofer sound normal again? Since I am bypassing the door speakers, the only thing the stock amp is being fed from the headunit through line-level is the subwoofer output meaning the amp isn't being overloaded.
Sounds right to me. Aftermarket HU's tend to already have amps built in, so sending an already amped source to another amp, only gives you twice the volume at half the setting.

aftermarket HU speaker level + stock amp = double volume, or 1+1=2...bad
aftermarket HU line level + stock amp = stock volume, or 0+1=1...good

Bypassing the amp allows the stock speakers to run off the HU's power through a harness and allows the stock sub to run off the stock amp. No double volume, no drown out...just good ole' sound. Another option would be to do a complete RCA splice for all channels on the stock wires and connect them through the pre-amp outputs, creating a happy listening environment. :-P

you'll have to forgive my child-like verbage...I'm no technical expert, this is how my brain interprets it and I feel it is an easy way to explain things without charts, graphs and an electrical engineering degree. :oops:

Here is my question...

I want to know if I was using a Lillibut touch screen that has FM receiver and will get data from a PC mounted in a custom console, could I wire it into the stock amp using the above diagrams?

I was never clear if there was one amp for all speakers including the sub or if there was a separate amp for the sub.

After reading the above posts I understand that there is one stock amp running all speakers and the Head has no amplification.

I don't believe there is any amplification in the lilliput. Someone shed light on this please.:confused::confused:

I found some posts earlier but they were closed... so.... I am looking for the stock wireing diagrams for the 2 clips on the factory amp.

I am trying to tap some of the wires for aftermarket amps and so forth.

I think this can be done cause I have done something like this in my bmw.

any help will be greatly welcomed

Green Plug (input from dash)
White = Front Left +
Orange = Front Left -
Yellow = Front Right+
Brown = Front Right -

Red = Rear Left +
Green = Rear Left -
Blue = Rear Right +
Black = Rear Right -

Red/White = Sub +
Red/Black = Sub -

Green/Yellow = Remote Turn On


Gray plug (output to speakers/sub)
Green/Black = Front Left +
Green = Front Left -
Green/Yellow = Front Right +
Blue/Yellow = Front Right -

Blue/White = Rear Left +
Blue/Black = Rear Left -
Pink = Rear Right +
Blue/Yellow = Rear Right -

Brown = Voice Coil 1 +
Red = Voice Coil 1 -
Blue = Voice Coil 2 +
Gray/Black = Voice Coil 2 -

Black = Ground
Blue/Orange = 12V+

ok i just used all of this to make some rca's and used the green/ yellow to turn the amps on.

for some strange reason the amp turn on lead burned up both of the amps through the turn on lead.

does anyone know why this might have happened?

has anyone else used this green/yellow wire to turn on thier amp(s)?
Did you have any problems?

thanks

ok i just used all of this to make some rca's and used the green/ yellow to turn the amps on.

for some strange reason the amp turn on lead burned up both of the amps through the turn on lead.

does anyone know why this might have happened?

has anyone else used this green/yellow wire to turn on thier amp(s)?
Did you have any problems?

thanks

I've used the green/yellow wire to turn on my amps but I tried splicing RCAs and they gave me weird problems/noise with my amp so I just bought a LOC and it solved the problem. Have you tried using the high-level input on your amps?

I have a new headunit now so I don't bother with any of that anymore. :)

I assume that you are referring to the large 20 pin and the smaller 14 pin connectors that plug into the factory amp. If so, I should be able to help you replace the factory amp without cutting and splicing any wires.

Let me explain, first I don’t have an Element but I do have an Acura TSX which happens to have the same type of premium sound system. The system uses a small Pioneer branded amp with an internal crossover for the front doors and tweeters as well as the sub. A coworker of mine has an Element and has agreed to let me verify the system wiring to be sure that it is the same. I’m sure it is, and Honda also uses this system on the Civic Si and Ex Coupes with premium sound. If everything checks out you can replace the factory amp and not have to cut any wires on your factory Harness. Whatever you do, do not splice the RCA plugs on to your factory wiring or by an amp because the factory premium HU does not have standard line level outputs. Splicing coaxial RCA cables to the HU outputs will cause noise and using the wrong amp will cause more noise.

I have been helping TSXers upgrade their systems for about a year now and my system works perfectly. I have also helped a few Civic owners and the results are the same.

By the way, the factory premium HU is quite a good source unit and provides a good flat output.

jeff

Jeff,

So what's the solution, then? What kind of output is coming from the HU if not line level? I have been planning to make some cuts to bypass the factory amp for all but the rear speakers so that I only have to install one amp. How would you connect the HU to the aftermarket amp?

Thanks,
Matt

First don’t cut any wires. Second, the output of the factory HU is Balanced Differential not coaxial line. I make a connector for the 14 pin harness that comes from the HU but I have to verify the pin out for the Element. I plan to do this in the next few days. Once I have verified the pin out, I can make you a plug in harness for the balanced audio. If you use an amp(s) with balanced Differential inputs you can connect your HU directly to your amps. If you use a regular car audio amp you will need an interface converter to go from balanced line to coaxial line. If you try to connect the HU outs to coaxial cable you will get noise. You will get more noise and kill your imaging if you use an amp without differential inputs.

The following amps work directly with the factory premium HU

All the current JL audio
The current Rockford F/G Punch and Power Series
The current Kicker ZX multi-channel amps.

I will also verify the speaker harness pin out to see if uses the same pin out as the other systems with the pioneer amp. If it so, you can buy a harness for that also.

If any one has the audio system pin outs (pin numbers) from the factory manual it would be very helpful.

jeff

What kind of an interface converter would you suggest? I may end up cutting my harness anyway, because I want to continue to use the factory amp for the rear speakers.

Additionally, the amp I'll be using has speaker level inputs—would those suffice?

Additionally, the amp I'll be using has speaker level inputs—would those suffice?

Not really. The voltage the HU sends out is very low. You'll have to set the gain almost at 3/4 to get to normal listening levels out of your speaker. Also, when I used a line-out converter with the amp, I'd have to set it at MAX to get sound. This was without a gain level adjuster on the LOC, but I bought a 4-Channel one from Walmart that had gains adjustment and it it helped a bit, but it sounded a bit, how would I say, crappy compared to an aftermarket HU preouts.

Also, if you purchase an aftermarket HU, you could use the HU's amp to power the rear speakers (with clean power) and use the amp to power the front/subs. This wold be a better set up. Trust me, I've done everything and ended up with getting a HU with preouts and that made my life that much easier.

Thanks for the tips. I'd like ideally to stick with the stock HU just for ease of use. I like the aux in and volume controls on the steering wheel (which I know can both be modded on with other aftermarket products, but you've got to draw the line somewhere...)

Looks like this number will be the key:
http://www.peripheralelectronics.com/prodDetail.asp?strProductID=572&strCategory=Premium%20Audio%20Interfacing&strSearch=

My local car audio shop said this will convert the differential-balanced signal to a single-ended signal so that I can run RCAs to my aftermarket amp (which is not fancy enough to do differential-balanced directly).

I don’t see in the information where it will take a balanced differential signal input, it might but I don’t see it). Another problem is the HU actual has five channels (I will verify this tomorrow weather permitting) and that device only supports four.

The HU output voltage is about +- 4 volts (think 8 volts) with a zero dB test CD on the other similar Honda/pioneer systems I have tested. I will have to verify this by actually testing the Element HU (I hope to this weekend). In any case, you can’t use the speaker level inputs on your amp. Your best bet is to go with an amp with the correct inputs because keeping the signals differential all the way to the amp prevents noise pick up.

I’m working on an electronic (active) interface converter for the premium system. It was to be a four channel unit but I might build a fifth channel to support the Element’s system. The goal is to plug into the factory amp connector and have your RCAs already to go to any amp you like.

You did say that you were interested in amping only the fronts and using the factory amp for the rears. This might not be very satisfying because of the big increase in SQ for the front. I don’t run the rear door speakers (a lot of people don’t) but again it is all personal tastes.

jeff

I don't see that information on their site, either, but I had a conversation with the guy at the car audio shop about it. He knew what I was talking about and said this LOC would do it. I found it mentioned on a few other boards in the same context, as well.

I would go with an amp that can handle the signal if they weren't all twice as much as I wanted to spend, unfortunately. Trying to stick to a budget...

For all those who were pissed off like I was when installing an aftermarket stereo (well myself a Carputer) and not knowing that my vehicle had a built in Amp or how to correctly wire it. The following diagrams are from an Official 2007 Honda Element service manual to save you ALOT of headache. I sure could of used this info 2 weeks ago. Forget the rest of the wiring diagrams you see out there this is IT!

If anyone needs further diagrams or assistance let me know...this thing has all the circuit digrams and wiring for the XM receiver also plus its a service manual so you name it and its in there. Damn thing is bigger then my phone book.

I'll go one better... http://www.elementownersclub.com/forums/showthread.php?t=42074


...not to toot my own horn :D

Nice Ill have to scan the one from my Service manual to top that...just kdding! I was going to post that to but I figured people would ask if they needed it since alot of people arent that techie. I must though that service manual is a god sent...worth every penny and only $80...I love Ebay.

Hello-

I've got a 2008 Element SC and am in need of the OEM stereo amplifier wiring diagram. Specifically I need the wire colors for the speaker inputs and outputs. If someone has a manual and can scan that page I would greatly appreciate it.

Thanks in advance!

-Brad

Hello-

I've got a 2008 Element SC and am in need of the OEM stereo amplifier wiring diagram. Specifically I need the wire colors for the speaker inputs and outputs. If someone has a manual and can scan that page I would greatly appreciate it.

Thanks in advance!

-Brad


Welcome to the EOC Brad.


This thread should contain the info you are after.

http://www.elementownersclub.com/forums/showthread.php?t=42074

Welcome to the EOC Brad.


This thread should contain the info you are after.

http://www.elementownersclub.com/forums/showthread.php?t=42074

Yes - this is EXACTLY what I need- thanks!

Can you tell me a little more about the "shield ground" for the low level amp signal? I'm using a Polk Momo 4-channel amp and caught my signal inputs from the radio to the amp (low level) but am experiencing some engine noise.
Any suggestions?

-Brad

Yes - this is EXACTLY what I need- thanks!

Can you tell me a little more about the "shield ground" for the low level amp signal? I'm using a Polk Momo 4-channel amp and caught my signal inputs from the radio to the amp (low level) but am experiencing some engine noise.
Any suggestions?

-Brad
The factory wires are part of a shielded cable which is grounded to prevent interference. Where did you tap into the wires, behind the radio or at the amp? This guy is having a similar problem. http://www.elementownersclub.com/forums/showthread.php?t=52345

Thanks lizzurd...my first referral, LOL.

I caught my wires at the amp in the passenger kick panel...

I've been searching and can't find the post with the picture of the back of the stock head unit with the callouts for the plugs and what each wire is. There's the one stick with the pinouts for the main harness, but I need to know which is the xm, sub, input, and all that jazz. Thanks.

on pg 9 of that sticky there is a shot of the back of the radio with explanation as to which harness is which.

Here's a schematic with all pinouts. http://www.elementownersclub.com/forums/showthread.php?t=42074