It will be interesting to see the distribution of Element owner political registrations! I've got my hunches but I could be very wrong!

Hmm, I don't think we have to fill out a party affiliation in VA when we register to vote. So, I can't fill out the survey, there's no option for "None"!

-brendan

EDIT: Come to think of it, I can't say for sure I never registered as a Democrat, I just know I haven't had to say so in the past 15 years. I *did* however, end up being a delegate (by accident, even! I'd been asked to round out the alternates, just in case...) to the VA presidential primary in 1992. So perhaps I'd registered as a Dem sometime in 1988-1992? Or maybe VA Dems didn't have a registration requirement?

Since everyone believes that everyone down here votes in three precincts and even after we are dead, do you want me to list my registration for each of the three or just an average?

Dead or alive, whichever one(s) of your jtgeorgia personalities bought the Element!

Is it true in all states that a registered voter without a party affiliation can't vote in any Presidential Primary? I thought it was the case nationally, but I could be wrong!

Good to know. Thanks.

Hey --- I don't see the "Submit Vote" Button anymore ... is that because the site's smart enough to know that I already voted or did I disable it somehow?

:roll:
Wrong thread

Wow Bush555.

At this point only 12 have voted, yet more than 1o times that have viewed. The votes aren't statistically significant yet, and I'll bet aren't even representative of the real distribution. Hope more vote!

> Virginia Democratic Presidential Primary (Open)

Ah, that might explain why I was able to be a delegate - it was Open.

-brendan

Before voting, I assumed that the majority of E owners would lean to the left of the political scale. Looks like I was wrong, although the sample size at 15 is still too small.

Regards,
Paul D.

>At this point only 12 have voted, yet more than 10 times that have viewed.

Could it possibly be that some of us really resent redirection of enthusiast/hobby discussion into political topics?

:evil:

I realize that full-blown debate hasn't happened here... yet... but almost without fail as soon as "the camel's nose is in the tent" about political issues, it's damn hard to keep the rest of the camel out. I really wish we hadn't gone here.

Things I was told to never talk about over diner:

Politics and Religion.

I can see the next poll.......

How many E owners are:
a. Muslims
b. non-muslims

:roll:

and the beat goes on.............

> No, I am a meat popsicle.

I loved that movie! I think it was "Negative, I am a meat popsicle.", though.

-brendan

Sorry MikeQBF. You're right. So is Zarathustra. This thread is probably doomed because it's just a matter of time before posts go to platform issues and the rest. And none of it has anything to do with the car. For what it's worth, it was a totally innocent poll when it started.

a gop'er who liked nader and voted for gore. what can i say prefer a clean env. to enjoy my E in.

honestly i expected things in this poll to show differently, but based on the fact that honda missed their target demographic i suppose the republican majority makes since. if they'd hit their demographic i bet things would've shown differently.

[quote:df14e4c6a1=" "]honestly i expected things in this poll to show differently, but based on the fact that honda missed their target demographic i suppose the republican majority makes since. if they'd hit their demographic i bet things would've shown differently.[/quote:df14e4c6a1]

Just a correction: a *registered* republican majority makes sense.

[Well, technically two corrections...]

I bet the numbers would also be flipped were this the Honda Civic Hybrid Owner's Club. :) ... though, had the emissions on the subaru outback surpassed the quality of the Element's emissions (like the subie's mpg rating does) I probably wouldn't be here...

...and I'd probably also be less obsessed with my car too.

-brendan

I like what President Bush has done to improve our environment, I like how he's helped to get our economy turned around (after inheriting a mess), and I like how he's winning our war on terrorism.

After careful consideration, I jumped into my Element with my wife, daughter and son, and we all voted for Bush on March 9.

On November 2, we will do it all again, including the ride in my Element.

Bush...environment? blink...blink...

Ok, well at least you're riding in an E.

-brendan

well, there went our nice non-argumentative environment.

how can you say you like what bush has done for the environment.
that is by far the most ignored and abused step child in his house?
(hey, i know---why don't we drill for oil in alaska? yeah yeah in the middle of a national park/wildlife reserve?)
and the war on terror?
he was doing alright in the beginning, but then to go into Iraq for no reason? we should have stayed in Afganistan. But hey, that's alright, after the Alaska oil thing was voted down, i guess we have to get our oil cheap SOMEWHERE. i suppose taking it from a country that has a leader that we don't like is fine. i mean why not? plus he pissed off Jr's papa and went after him, so sure--why not?
hey! if we re-elect him, i bet we'll end up in North Korea (where they really do have "Weapons of Mass Destruction") and maybe they will use their WMD and nuke our entire country?!!? That would be great, then we wouldn't have to worry about the national deficit! or human rights for that matter!
wow, it would be a lot simpler! so yeah, lets re-elect the trigger happy bigot from the back woods, that's a fantastic idea!
I also drove my E! to the polls for my primary and I will be driving my E! to the polls on November 2nd, and i am proud to say that I have never and will never vote for that man.

I would rather see Camel Toes. . .then the camel's nose. :lol: :lol: :lol:

http://www.cameltoe.org

I know some of you get your info from the dumbest profession on this planet (journalism), however, every one of you has internet access.

Bush's environmental policy and funding recommendations are here:
http://usinfo.state.gov/gi/Archive/2004/Feb/04-761809.html

As far as drilling in Alaska, the land that will be used is flat frozen tundra. There is nothing "pristine" about the place.

Iraq is just another battle in the war on terror. There will be more. Question; Why do you think Libya rolled over? Hint: Quadaffy saw what happened to Saddam. Syria, Iran, & North Korea are taking note of what we are doing.

And, by buying an Element, I'm helping the folks in Ohio get back to work! :P

Oh ok. Now I understand: by "for the environment" you meant "for access to natural-resources". I got it now. :)

-brendan

Exactly, Brendan...

Especially if you think reducing coal-fired electrical plants emissions to zero is the same as "access to natural-resources".

[quote:9e3bfff292=" "]Exactly, Brendan...

Especially if you think reducing coal-fired electrical plants emissions to zero is the same as "access to natural-resources".[/quote:9e3bfff292]

You are flat out killing me! :)

Bush is moving the date that the EPA will start cutting back mercury emissions three years further out into the future than the previous administration and reduced the target of 90-95% mercury reduction to 29% reduction:

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/articles/A8179-2004Mar19.html

> The greatest single source of mercury in the environment is coal-fired
> power plants. Emissions from the plants drift into lakes and streams,
> where they are transformed in combination with bacteria to methyl
> mercury. The bacteria is then eaten by fish, which are then eaten by
> larger and larger fish -- ending with deep-sea fish like tuna and
> swordfish. The Clinton administration proposed rules to limit mercury
> emissions by 2007. The Bush administration has pushed back demands
> to begin cutting mercury emissions to 2010.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/articles/A58608-2004Mar14.html

> But the Bush administration and its industry allies say research gaps and
> equipment shortages make it virtually impossible for plants using ACI or
> anything else to achieve the targets mandated by the Clean Air Act -- a
> 90 to 95 percent reduction in mercury emissions by 2007.
>
> Instead, the Bush administration has used a different section of the act
> to propose a new target of a 29 percent reduction by 2007 and an
> industry-wide reduction of 70 percent by 2018. That prescription is
> scoffed at by environmentalists, who say ongoing tests at Gaston 3
> and elsewhere show the Bush targets are far too modest.

etc.

I know *why* they did it (or at least, why they think they did), but it certainly was not pro-environment.

Bush's administration also *stopped* 7 lawsuits by the EPA that were in progress against coal-fired plants for flagant violation of the rules under the last administration:

http://northstar.sierraclub.org/campaigns/air/coal/schaefferTestimony.html

I'm staying away from the hot political topics here on EOC (the war(s), the economy), but this particular topic is so darned obvious.

So...if you're more a pro-business sort and are willing to trade away a certain amount of the future safety (and beauty) of our environment, JUST SAY SO. I've got friends like that, they are fine people, we just disagree.

But to state that Bush gets your vote on his environmental record...man...you must be smoking something awful...or maybe there's a bit too much mercury in your fish?

Even members of his own party won't use the administration's suggested bullet points on the environment:
http://www.thedesertsun.com/news/stories2004/election/20040323010458.shtml
http://www.thedesertsun.com/news/stories2004/national/20040323010333.shtml

-brendan

well done brendan.

So Brendan you don't want Bush to eliminate coal fired emissions?

From his environmental goals:
--$447 million for the President's Coal Research Initiative to improve the environmental performance of coal power plants by reducing emissions and improving efficiency. This includes $237 million for the "FutureGen" coal-fired, zero-emissions electricity and hydrogen power plant announced by the President in February 2003. While this program is not part of the environment crosscut, it is worth noting as an important initiative.

You do realize BlowJ handed down most of his environmental edicts during his last couple of months in office, right? You do realize he did nothing for 8 years. Is that what you want our current President to do?


And you do realize the Element has an excellent emissions record, right?

[quote:950945aadc=" "]And you do realize the Element has an excellent emissions record, right?[/quote:950945aadc]

Something we agree on! :)

[quote:950945aadc=" "]You do realize BlowJ handed down most of his environmental edicts during his last couple of months in office, right? [/quote:950945aadc]

First of all, are we even going to go there, or should we stick to policy and not the sex lives of officials?

The Clean Air Act goals that Bush & Co. are gutting were put together WAAAY before Clinton got in office. I believe it was last updated in 1990 during Bush I's time in office.

[quote:950945aadc=" "]You do realize he did nothing for 8 years. Is that what you want our current President to do? [/quote:950945aadc]

No. I'd rather Bush did nothing for only 4 years.

And sadly, what he's doing is mostly worse than nothing.

Do you realize the contradictions you just stated above: both "environmental edicts" and "nothing", right?

[quote:950945aadc=" "]So Brendan you don't want Bush to eliminate coal fired emissions?

From his environmental goals:...
--$447 million for the President's Coal Research Initiative to improve the environmental performance of coal power plants by reducing emissions and improving efficiency. This includes $237 million for the "FutureGen" coal-fired, zero-emissions electricity and hydrogen power plant announced by the President in February 2003. While this program is not part of the environment crosscut, it is worth noting as an important initiative.
[/quote:950945aadc]

Oh fine. I thought we were going to keep it on the level. If you want to keep your head in the sand on this issue, be my guest. I layed out good background material for my point. You keep referring back to the administration's press release.

Zero-emmissions plants are a great idea! It's great there's going to be funding into the technology! It just clear that the technology won't be ready for production work for at least a decade or two. How does this help with reducing emissions now (for example, during the time period my children will be growing up)?

-brendan

Hey, who here likes them new Lay's Dill Pickle flavored potato chips?
http://www.taquitos.net/dbimages13/Lays-USA-DP.jpg

Damn that's a fine snack.

brendan and mikesmith,
I won't say who, but one of you have done research, one of you seems to be spewing spoonfed misinformation. :twisted:

[quote:aca993c291=" "]Hey, who here likes them new Lay's Dill Pickle flavored potato chips?
Damn that's a fine snack.[/quote:aca993c291]

Clearly, you're wrong! Everyone knows that Route 11 Salt & Vinegar chips are much better!

http://www.taquitos.net/dbimages13/Route11-PC-SV.jpg

-brendan

PS - Edit: heck, they've even got a great jingle! http://www.rt11.com/rt11/index.cfm?fa=jingle&key=0 How can they not be better???

Clearly, you're wrong! Everyone knows that Route 11 Salt & Vinegar chips are much better!
yummmm... douche flavor chips..

Now that you mentioned it I do get a fresh, clean kind of feeling after I eat a bag. Fresh and clean like a Carolina pine forest.........or maybe that was the floor cleaner I drank with it.


Potato Chips.......there ain't no easier way to train wreck a political discussion :lol:

Tater chips are way too salty.....

And who are you going to believe? Mis-informed journalists and enviro-whackos or our President?

Free clue: Journalism is the dumbest profession on this planet.
They don't even like Elements!

Zero-emmissions plants are a great idea! It's great there's going to be funding into the technology! It just clear that the technology won't be ready for production work for at least a decade or two. How does this help with reducing emissions now (for example, during the time period my children will be growing up)?

Brendan, what you and I want is not possible. All of the plants cannot be converted overnight. However, there must be a "start" at some time. That time is now (instead of 1993).

[quote:3f38ad825e=" "]
And who are you going to believe? Mis-informed journalists and enviro-whackos or our President?

Free clue: Journalism is the dumbest profession on this planet.
They don't even like Elements![/quote:3f38ad825e]

im more inclined to believe the "Mis-informed journalists and enviro-whackos" myself, oh wait....
i AM a "Mis-informed journalist and enviro-whacko". damn.

when W starts telling the truth, maybe other people will begin to take him seriously, but until that time, he's just going to have to be happy with having been a one term wonder. (kind of like Dexy's Midnight Runner's in the 80's with their one hit wonder Come on Eileen) i think that he's probably the worst president we've had since reagan. he has done absolutely nothing positive for this country and has only managed to create more riffs and ruffles within the American public when it was a time when all of us should have been united. but he managed to tear us apart, what a fantastic leader!


if by some malicious and sneaky way he manages to cheat again, er...get elected again, i'm moving to Canada.


And the best chips are the Carolina BBQ Chips.

I was 18 in '72 when the 18 yr old got the right to vote. I have voted every time it has been available to me my entire life.
If You don't vote - don't bitch.

[quote:cedf89051f=" "]If You don't vote - don't bitch.[/quote:cedf89051f]

hear hear!

Caveat: that means everyone under 18 gets to bitch! :)

-brendan

[quote:dabadf9f3c=" "][quote:dabadf9f3c=" "]If You don't vote - don't bitch.[/quote:dabadf9f3c]

hear hear!

Caveat: that means everyone under 18 gets to bitch! :)

-brendan[/quote:dabadf9f3c]

I'd be happy to hear anyone under 18 bitching - that means they are at least interested in what happens besides NicK and Jessica, or who sang the best on American Idol last night, blah, blah, blah.
:roll:
Amy