The other day, the side airbag in the Driver's seat inadvertantly deployed. Has anyone ever heard of this happening? My wife said she heard a "pop" after hitting a pothole. She swears it wasn't a big pothole and there is no other damage other than the stupid airbag.

I took it to my dealer and they are blaming the deployment on the aftermarket horn we installed. Now I might not be a rocket scientists but if the horn wasn't activated I can't see how the dealer could be right.

Anybody have any ideas?

Jolly

>they are blaming the deployment on the aftermarket horn we installed.

Baloney. What they assert is impossible.

The side impact sensor is in the sill right below the pseudo-B-pillar, and connects into the floor harness. The wire path from the sensor to the SRS module is almost a straight line. It goes nowhere near the front of the vehicle.

There is SRS wiring near the horn, but that is for the main system. If it was the driver's front bag that deployed, then they'd have a case.

They're fishing for an easy excuse to transfer responsibility to you because of all the paperwork involved in documenting an SRS deployment. Find another dealer, because IMO they are more interested in covering their butts than helping you.

go to another dealer if possible.. :shock:

I am glad to have found this post - although it is old. On 27 May 2005, my driver's side side-impact airbag spontaneously deployed. Dealer is admitting manufactuire's defect but will not fix the vehicle. There are not any other dealers in the area, so I can't bring it to another for advise. Anyone out there with advise?

Thanks
AKnElement

I just want to say that Mike is obviously a walking element wiring diagram.. why even post stuff like this.. just send him a private message.

BTW - if someone thought I was being sarcastic about that comment- I wasn't. He really knows his s**t.

I am glad to have found this post - although it is old. On 27 May 2005, my driver's side side-impact airbag spontaneously deployed. Dealer is admitting manufactuire's defect but will not fix the vehicle. There are not any other dealers in the area, so I can't bring it to another for advise. Anyone out there with advise?

Thanks
AKnElement
Contact HONDA!!!!!

really, i second that.

get on the phone with honda usa. any airbag false deployment is serious business, and they will come down hard on the dealer for not fixing it.

Contact HONDA!!!!!
No really, contact them now. And I thought Honda dealers were some of the bes t...

No really, contact them now. And I thought Honda dealers were some of the bes t...

I couldn't agree more. Ok, so it's a vehicle defect-but what about a huge safety concern...... :-x

That would piss me off if some dealership said that to me, esspecially if my car was still under warrenty AND they admit to it being a defect. I would contact Honda USA and any other dealership in the area. Good luck and keep us posted.

Well one would think that Honda America would come down hard on the dealership for not fixing the vehicle, but they're not. The customer service at the dealership AND at Honda America is horrible!

Today I found out the parts are on national backorder and the car won't be fixed until the end of July 2005. Up until today, Honda wasn't paying for a rental car (which was running me $40/day). I ended up going down to the dealership today and after an hour's conversation, they agreed to paying for a rental car.

To me not all of the pieces are adding up. I can't get an answer as to why Honda isn't covering the airbag - even though we have bumper to bumper warranty.

When this initially happened, Honda America told me to file a claim with my insurance company (said this is how they deal with these matters). I had my insurance involved, they also determined that it was manufactures defect, but they paid for it (minus the deductable) to get the process going of getting it fixed. Then, they sumbitted a claim to Honda America to get reimbursed for the payment.

This is all such a mess!!!!!!

AknElement

This doesn't seem right at all. Isn't the whole purpose of a warranty to replace or fix defective parts?

This doesn't seem right at all. Isn't the whole purpose of a warranty to replace or fix defective parts?


Exactly - I just don't understand!!!!

AKnElement

Most cities have at least one TV station with a "consumer advocate," or "trouble shooter," or whatever they call it in that area.

Basically this is a pit-bull, take-no-prisoners, reporter who makes their living 60 Minutes-style, by sticking a camera and mic into the face of a sleazy roofer, or a charlatan car dealer, and demanding satisfaction for some consumer who's been ripped-off.

Or, you might call Clark Howard and have him bite 'em on the a** for you.

Even just telling the local dealer or Honda America what you're getting ready to do might change their demeanor.

It really shows that some people don't think anymore. Don't people know that word of mouth is huge, esspecially for any business. Even worse, a club like EOC where the word can spread like a wild fire. That dealership needs to compensate you for everything. As I posted earlier, it's a defect and can be fixed, but what about your safety? What a bunch of crap :x. Honda USA better do something! IF you already called, I would call again, and again, and again. Keep going up the chain and tell them they need to fix your car. This is why so many people buy from Honda. They are great reliable cars and have (for the most part) taken care of their customers. This is rediculous.

I truly hope this gets resolved in a timly manner. I hope that your dealership pulls their heads out of their ..... and fixes your E. Sorry to go on and on, but this kind of stuff pisses me off and can easily be fixed. I can't believe they made you go through your insurance either......what the he11 is a warrenty for then????

Good luck and keep us posted.

BTW, where are you located/what dealership? Good warning for others that are shopping....

I just want to say that Mike is obviously a walking element wiring diagram.. why even post stuff like this.. just send him a private message.

Why would you suggest people send Mike a private message on a safety related concern? That doesn't make sense. This is something that EVERYONE owning an Element with Front Side Airbags needs to be made aware of.

If your dealers refuse to do anything about this and there is not another dealer in your area then obviously you need to contact American Honda. If they won't help then contact American Honda CORPORATE and ask to speak to an Executive...

http://automobiles.honda.com/images/info/customer_relations/cust_service_phone_icon.gifhttp://automobiles.honda.com/images/_trans_pix.gifhttp://automobiles.honda.com/images/_trans_pix.gif
By Phone
At our toll-free number: (800) 999-1009

http://automobiles.honda.com/images/info/customer_relations/cust_service_fax_icon.gifhttp://automobiles.honda.com/images/_trans_pix.gifBy Fax
(310) 783-3023 (24 Hours)

http://automobiles.honda.com/images/info/customer_relations/cust_service_mail_icon.gifhttp://automobiles.honda.com/images/_trans_pix.gifBy Mail

American Honda Motor Co., Inc.
Honda Automobile Customer Service
1919 Torrance Boulevard
Mail Stop: 500 - 2N - 7D
Torrance, CA 90501-2746

Here is a telephone number at American Honda Corporate Offices: (310) 783-2114.

Ask for the Executive Offices and take it from there. Explain the situation and someone will pass you on to someone that will help. Stress the seriousness, but above all... remain calm and NICE. Don't yell it won't get you anywhere.

Keep us posted about what happens.

Thank you for the compliment and the confidence, James, but like Larry said, best to answer such queries "out here" so everyone gets the benefit on those occasions I have the service manual at my fingertips.

I think the proper response to these unexplained deployments is to file a report with NHTSA (http://www.safercar.gov). Some of the "older"... uhh... "more senior" members will remember that this was the suggested approach with the old windshield cracking issue, and that in the end it didn't seem to accomplish much. HOWEVER, the overseers have a much shorter fuse when it comes to misfunctioning safety systems, and reports of mal-firing airbags are going to grab their attention.

Not that I wish this particular ill upon Honda, or the E's reputation, but two unrelated reports in our non-representative community are simply two too many.

BTW, where are you located/what dealership? Good warning for others that are shopping....


Anchorage Alaska

Continental Honda and Accura

Thanks to all those who have replied and offered suggestions to getting this resolved.

I intend to follow-up with these on Monday (as it is 2 PM on Friday here and the lower 48 has already started their weekend).

I will keep you posted...

AKnElement

Well - last time I was in the dealer I was told that the car wouldn't get fixed until the END OF JULY! I had just reviewed the AKn Lemon Law and it says something in there about 30 days. I stated this when I was in there and a miracle must have happened because I rec'd a call last night that the Element is fixed and ready for pickup.

I am headed down there shortly to pick up my car. Hopefully no more issues!

AKnElement

I would take a real close look at that airbag and the wiring leading to it.
One minute they're on back order, the next it's ready for pick-up.

I smell a repacked bag.
(Slang for when crappy shops stuff the deployed bag back into the housing
and use plastic weld or some other appropriate adhesive to seal it back up.)

That would actually be kind of cool.
I can't believe a dealer would be THAT stupid, but... :roll:
You could really hang their rears out to dry if you caught them doing it.

After reading this post I can honestly say this is the first time I have been happy that i own a 2004 EX instead of the EXS.

You should also report this incident to the NHTSA. Any major safety issue like this should be reported to them, so they can identify and rectify any safety defects. Severe injuries an air bag deployment can be the result, even when caused by an actual accident. Ask the dealer to give you their opinion in writing so you can see how stupid they really are.

My wife and I have owned our MM EX E since March 18, 2005. We love it!!!! Well not so much right now. I have also been a EOC member for as long but haven't posted anything. Just enjoy reading everything about the E. Great site!!!!

I have been a long time Honda Accord owner (1990, 193,860 miles and still running strong) and have never had a problem. Made the mistake several years back and bought a Ford (Explorer 1999) as a new second car. After the five years of recalls and numerous issues, I vow never to buy a Ford again. So I went back to Honda because since the E came out I had to have one and of course there excellent track record with finely engineered vehicles also helped.

Well, this past Friday night the driver’s side airbag deployed with no apparent reason. We pulled into my cousins drive way and "boom" the air bag deployed. Bruised the back of my arm and shocked the h*** out of my wife and I. The drive way is paved and doesn't even have a large hump at the entrance. I didn't hit or run anything over and I wasn't traveling very fast. It just deployed. Found this posting, which made me feel a little better until reading through it. I can't believe this isn't covered under warranty but I was afraid it might not be. I haven't spoken to my dealer yet but I figured I would get the posting started and keep people informed as the process unfolds. Plus I really needed to vent and maybe someone would have some words of wisdom.

Skidog529

this is interesting. can you give more background on your mileage, equipment (like an A/T or 5speed) and how many months you've had your E? any other history like prior accidents or damage? PLEASE let us know how this is resolved through Honda as well.

So, that is 3 times this has happened, that we know of so far? Wow, that is scary. I don't understand why that would not be covered. Especially on the 2005!! I'll be interested to see what happens when it goes to the dealer. Maybe Honda really needs to look into this.

There is no way this is not covered by the warranty. I can guarantee that if this were to happen to my Element even if I were out of warranty... it would get paid for by Honda and not by me or my insurance.

Unfortunately GRogers913 and AKnElement have not kept us updated as to the outcomes of either incident. Hopefully you will be able to let us know what happens.

Bring the E into the dealer and have them take care of it. If they give you a hard time about it not being a warranty issue then have them bring in the Honda Rep and you call Customer Care. If you have even a halfway decent dealer they will cover this no questions asked so long as there is no sign of an accident.

this is interesting. can you give more background on your mileage, equipment (like an A/T or 5speed) and how many months you've had your E? any other history like prior accidents or damage? PLEASE let us know how this is resolved through Honda as well.

My E is 2005 MM EX, 5-speed. It has the entire standard feature associated with the EX model. I have only added OEM accessories (fog lights, front bumper trim, rear bumper trim, side steps, splash guards, roof rack, tailgate deflector, wheel locks, steering wheel cover, all-season floor mats, cargo tray, interior privacy curtain, half-nose mask and skylight shade screen which I have not installed). I bought it March 18, 2005 and it had 2.4 miles on it when I test drove it. It's almost 6 months old and has 9,450 miles on it. It has never been in an accident or needed any other repairs. I'll keep you posted on what happens.

Skidog529

There is no way this is not covered by the warranty. I can guarantee that if this were to happen to my Element even if I were out of warranty... it would get paid for by Honda and not by me or my insurance.

Unfortunately GRogers913 and AKnElement have not kept us updated as to the outcomes of either incident. Hopefully you will be able to let us know what happens.

Bring the E into the dealer and have them take care of it. If they give you a hard time about it not being a warranty issue then have them bring in the Honda Rep and you call Customer Care. If you have even a halfway decent dealer they will cover this no questions asked so long as there is no sign of an accident.

I guarantee you there is no sign of an accident or damage. I didn't hit anything. I've never had it off paved roads. But I can tell you all this "I didn't take no for an answer at Ford so I'm sure I will not take it from Honda". It took me to get some upper people involved at Ford, but I finally got results. They extended my warranty for the length of my loan. This covered the transmission I needed the last year I owned it.

Skidog529

This is kind of frightening.... :-o hopefully if it's a common problem they will issue a recall.

My way of looking at this is the following:

3 people on a site with about 10,000 registered users for a vehicle with around 150-200,000 vehicles is quite a bit for side airbags self deploying. Of the 150-200,000 vehicles how many were sold with front side airbags?

We are only talking 3 people that reported this problem ON THIS SITE, not every Element owner posts on here let alone posts every single issue on here.

Were even 50,000 total Elements sold with the front side airbags? Is that way too much of an estimate?

This is certainly something that American Honda should be interested in... if they aren't then NHTSA most certainly would be interested in if everyone that has had this happen reported it on the NHTSA website.

Checking the NHTSA website I see no complaints for 2003, 1 complaint for 2004 (ODI ID Number : 10111175) and none for 2005.

So based on only a single complaint filed with NHTSA... Honda can conclude only one other person has had this problem.

Unfortunately AKnElement never filed with NHTSA. His accident he said was on May 27, 2005. The filed report said their failure was February 8, 2005.

If these types of serious issues are never reported then car companies can easily say they didn't know about them.

Report Date : September 12, 2005 at 05:48 PM SEARCH TYPE : VEHICLE YEAR : 2004 Make : HONDA Model : ELEMENT Type : ANY http://www-odi.nhtsa.dot.gov/images/spacer.gif http://www-odi.nhtsa.dot.gov/images/spacer.gif Results : 1 | All records displayed Make : HONDA Model : ELEMENT Year : 2004 Manufacturer : HONDA (AMERICAN HONDA MOTOR CO.) Crash : No Fire : No Number of Injuries: 1 ODI ID Number : 10111175 Number of Deaths: 0 Date of Failure: February 8, 2005 VIN : 5J6YH17614L... Component: AIR BAGS:SIDE/WINDOW Summary:
http://www-odi.nhtsa.dot.gov/images/spacer.gif WHILE DRIVING APPROXIMATELY 35 MPH DRIVER'S SIDE AIR BAG INADVERTENTLY DEPLOYED. THE CAUSE OF WHY THIS HAPPENED IS UNDETERMINED.*AK Check to Request Research. Submit below.
Take this with you to the dealer... Also print out this entire thread and try and contact AKnElement as well as the first person that complained.

What Larry said. NHTSA is the proper place.

Reporting here on EOC may be palliative, but nothing will happen other than mutual hand-wringing.

I'm fully aware that nothing will happen, if I just posting on this site. I figured this site would help get the word out if this becomes a problem. This is the first place I came too. So you know, I have every intention on posting this on the NHTSA site. Just don't have the time at this moment. I should have the time by over the weekend.

I called my dealer last night, they where very nice and apologetic. They where also very surprised and haven’t heard of any other cases. They wanted me to bring it right in. Unfortunately I couldn't so I have an appointment Thursday after work. They told me they will do whatever it takes to fix and/or correct the problem. The guy I spoke to said he hadn't heard of anything like this. So he was going to look into it. I mentioned this site and he said he know of it and would read what was posted.

I'll post more as it unfolds.

Todd (skidog529)

Todd, I didn't mean to imply that you weren't going to report it to NHTSA. All I meant was you are the 3rd person to report this major safety problem on EOC and the first 2 people never reported the problem to NHTSA. So right now we can confirm 4 cases of side airbags being deployed... and after you report yours NHTSA and American Honda officially will only know of 50% of them. That was my only point in giving out the NHTSA information.

Things can't become a safety related issue until it is officially reported to NHTSA. Once enough issues are recorded on an item then NHTSA acts upon it or maybe Honda monitors the NHTSA site looking for complaints. Either way the problems will eventually make it to those in charge and can actually do something about it.

After your dealer takes care of your airbag problem post who they are, it is always good to say the good things about a dealer and not just the bad. So far they sound very concerned and are going to do what a dealer should do in all cases like this. Please keep us posted and good luck with everything.

Larry, Sorry that wasn't directed at you. I was re-plying to MikeQBF's comment. Maybe I misunderstood him. It sounded like he thought I thought I was going to get results from this site. All I wanted to do, was to keep my fellow E owners informed. I was a little disappointed when the others didn't.

Todd (Skidog529)

Todd, no harm no foul. :) Mike meant the same thing. We just are trying to direct everyone to NHTSA, especially for issues like this. He wasn't sure if you were going to report it or not. You would also be amazed at the number of people who think that just because Honda reads this site our issues become a priority with Honda.

Please keep us informed once you get it all resolved.

Took the E into my local dealership (Dean Honda, West Mifflin PA) last Thursday, for them to look into why my driver side, side impact air bag inadvertently deployed. I was told they would have to keep my E so they could investigate why it deployed. But they would give me a rental car at no cost to me. I was told it should only be a few days. I was picked up by Enterprise and taken to their local office to pick up the rental. Well once I got there they needed either my car insurance or I could pay $20 a day for their insurance. I really figured when they told me at Dean Honda that Honda would take care of the rental, I wouldn't have to pay anything. (That's one thing I can say about Ford, they did give me a loaner car until they fixed the issues I was having with my Explorer). I guess I wouldn't if I would have used my car insurance but I figured it would be cheaper to pay the $20 a day for a few days, instead of my deductible (if in an accident). There is no way it could equal my deductible. Especially after getting the call Friday afternoon telling me they couldn't find any reason why it deployed and it would be replaced under warranty. He said they should have the new seat Monday morning and it would be back to me that afternoon, baring no un-foreseen problems. Well they called me yesterday (Monday) afternoon and told me they ordered the wrong seat and it wouldn't be done until hopefully today. I told him I would be bringing the rental car back right away because I couldn't afford to pay $20 a day in insurance. He wasn't aware that I would have to insure the car myself. He thought that was covered in the agreement they have with Honda. But he couldn't guaranty that. So I decided to take the rental car back to Honda.

I was hoping to post this issue on the NHTSA site this past weekend but I was a little out of it after finding out that my 91 year old grandmother past away Saturday morning. I will hopefully get it back today. I really need it because I have to get to the funeral later this week. I really don't feel comfortable taking my 1990 Accord which has 189,000+ miles on it, a crossed PA.

Will post when I get it back.

Skidog529

i think you were mistaken, doesn't the rental car agency just need proof of your insurance?

Sorry to hear about your Grandmother... :(

You shouldn't have to pay anything for the rental with Enterprise... that is rather odd. Speak with your Service Advisor when you pick your car up. They will get the monies reimbursed for you.

Other than them ordering the wrong seat, it is good that they covered this without issue... but not good that they couldn't find anything wrong. Ask them if the seat is being shipped back to Honda for further study... if not, ask them to call the Honda Tech line and at your urging have them insist it be studied.

i think you were mistaken, doesn't the rental car agency just need proof of your insurance?

Maybe other car rental companies. Not from what they told me at enterprise and what it says on the invoice. They don't insure the vehicle for you for free. You have to provide insurance or pay for insurance. Just like when you rent a U-Haul truck. If you use your insurance and wreak the vehicle you have to pay your deductible. With their insurance you pay nothing.

Sorry to hear about your Grandmother... :(

You shouldn't have to pay anything for the rental with Enterprise... that is rather odd. Speak with your Service Advisor when you pick your car up. They will get the monies reimbursed for you.

Other than them ordering the wrong seat, it is good that they covered this without issue... but not good that they couldn't find anything wrong. Ask them if the seat is being shipped back to Honda for further study... if not, ask them to call the Honda Tech line and at your urging have them insist it be studied.

Thanks Larry!

The service advisor did say I shouldn't have had to pay anything. He also mentioned that he might be able to get my monies back, but couldn't guaranty that he would be able too. So I elected not to keep it any longer. I really didn't need it anyway. I was paying $20 a day for my wife to take it about a half mile down the hill to the bus, because I'm too lazy to get my butt out of bed early to take her.

I do believe I remember him telling me they will be sending the seat to Honda for further evaluation. I will ask when I pick it up. All in all I am very please with the service Dean Honda has shown me. I'll go back.

Todd

Update....

Sorry it has taken me some time to get back to post. Very busy!!!!! Now the story has grown so large that it would take me a day to type the whole thing. So here is the shortened version with just some of the highlights.

Here it is week five since my side air bag inadvertently deployed and my dealer is still waiting on parts. From the day I dropped it off at Dean Honda
, Pittsburgh I was told it should only take a few day at the most. Well three weeks ago and two calls from them say it would be done tomorrow. Then being told well we order the wrong color, well some of the parts came in and some are on back order. I needed my E to get to funeral. So I just picked it up and told them to call me when all of the parts are in. After waiting two weeks I called my service assistant to see what was going on. He said that the parts departments responsibility to call me when the parts are in to schedule an appointment. But he would do me a favor and look in to it. He found out that some of the parts where on back order and by chance the area parts manager was in that day and was going to look into it. I feel if I hadn't called I would have still been waiting for them to call. I was told everything would be in with in a week. Well they called last Monday and said we have everything. So I took it in Tuesday and was told it should only take a day. I didn't hear by the end of the day Wednesday. So, I called and was told they just didn't get it done. Found out Thursday, that it wasn't done because they needed another part that would be in Friday. Did get a call all day Friday (so I figure I was going to get a call late in the day telling me the part they ordered didn't come in that it was back ordered) Well that's what happened. Needless to say I was a little PO'd at that point. So I gave the service assistant an ear full. Then he transferred me to the service manager, who could only say "what is it you would like us to do". "What do you think; we are holding your car hostage". The comments like that kept flowing. I can't believe when they order a part, they have no idea if it's a long lead item and if that's the case (which I find hard to believe) fine. Then it should be someone’s responsibility to follow up to find out why not and when they are coming in. I'm a mech. engineer and I know I can check our system for a part and see if we have it on hand and if not when it will be in. Plus if I order something are can find out what the lead time is. So to end the story for now I'M STILL WAITING!!!! I hope this is just a dealer thing and not how Honda conducts warranty service throughout the corporation.

skidog529

PS Larry I haven't forgotten about posting my faulty air problem on the NHTSA site. I know it not a good excuse but I’m just a little short right now.

I cannot believe after 5 weeks that Honda has not fixed your Element. :( That truly sucks.

I agree with you that they should be able to track lead times and tell how long a part is on back order. Have you ever contacted Honda Customer Service regarding this? If not, I would give them a call. I would also contact the person you purchased your E from, maybe your salesman can do something about this.

I would also check out PA's Lemon Law. Safety items generally take precedence when it comes to how long you are without them. I realize you have had the Element in your possession the majority of the time so teh 30 day out of service rule might be a factor. But you also have been driving an "unsafe" car all this time. It can't hurt to check that avenue as well.

Sorry your Dealer has not kept on top of this. Thanks for taking the time to post an update as well. Hopefully this gets taken care of soon.

seriously man, call honda USA in california, and give them an earfull.

they should be all over this.