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Accidental Side Airbag Deployment

36K views 147 replies 48 participants last post by  davecoon13 
#1 · (Edited)
PLEASE READ...very important for element owners!!!!

Hi all,

Had a scary thing happen the other day. While driving home from work on a nice smooth So. Cal freeway on a nice sunny day, the drivers side, side airbag just decided to deploy! As anyone who has ever been in an accident can tell you, It's quite a ruckus when these let loose! My ears where ringing and my eyes burning but I was able to keep the car under control and avoided any further damages to my self or others...Pretty lucky I think!

I pull over and have a look at the car and think, where's the bullet holes? Everything looks just fine...no damages to anything but the drivers side seat which has the seam blown out and this little blue bag a little bigger than a sock dangling down to the side. I took a look at my upper arm and noticed a pretty healthy welt comming up where the bag had smacked me on the way out. Still, pretty lucky I think...

Long story short, I took it to the dealer. After 2 days of "looking at the car", they determined it was my fault and that I hit or ran over something that hit the sensor under the car causing the bag to deploy and either my self or my insurance would be paying the $980 it would cost to repair the 6 month old car.

Please understand this is about the safety issue not the $980. I have had the car since it had 4 miles on it and have never hit or been hit by anything other than a rock the size of a marble that broke my windshield. I've never run over anything either. Let me ask this, If this sensor is so succeptable to being hit , why is it under the car of all places? Seems like a poor choice to me.

Anyway, after the dealership told me I was on my own, I started doing a little research on some of the popular Element sites like this one, hondasuv.com and also the NHTSA site. I found there had been several of these accidental deployments and almost all had the exact same response from the dealer. What bothered me most was that only 2 of the incidents where reported to the NHTSA!

The NHTSA is the government agency that keeps info on these sort of defects and if enough of them get reported they'll do an investigation and if it is warranted will force the manufacturer to fix the problem through a recall! The catch is...People have to report the problem to the NHTSA! No report, no repairs and the problem never gets fixed. It's very simple to report a problem...just go tohttp://www.safercar.gov/ and click on "report a problem.

Anyway, if any of you have had this problem or know any of the other Element owners who have, please let me know or point them to the NHTSA site to fillout a report. You can drop me a note here or e-mail it to me at phil2000@pacbell.net. It's my hope we can get this repaired for all of us before it causes someone to be seriously injured or killed.

Thanks for taking the time to read this. Who knows maybe we can save a few lives here for nothing more than the time to fill out a report!
 
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#2 ·
Okay, sorry to hear about what happened and all.

But please don't spam the forum with the same post over different forums. I have deleted the 4 other threads you made and left this one up. Hopefully some other members can give you some insight to you problem.
 
#4 ·
My take is if the air bag deploys without any physical damage to the car, the manufacturer is responsible.

I would escalate the matter to Honda now that the dealer won't own up to it. If Honda itself denies you, find a lawyer.

This is obviously out of spec, and if something did hit the sensor, then the sensor design is flawed.

Let the lawyer deals with it. This could have caused a serious accident that can potential harmed or killed you....and you were injured both physically and mentally by the incident. On top of that, you are now wasting time with the boneheaded dealer.
 
#5 ·
This is scary stuff, what really amazes me is that the dealers are arguing with people about covering the repair! If they refuse to cover it you could always threaten to paint the car yellow and sit in front of the dealership telling everyone that passes what great customer service they provide. Belive it or not this has worked for a few of my friends in the past.
 
#6 ·
^ A bit extreme in this case, don't you think?

This would have scared me sh!tless. I'd appeal the repair to the district service rep and get Honda to pay for it. I can't think that would be too tough, given the circumstances. You should be able to get the district service manager's number from a dealer.
 
#8 ·
That is very scary... I know that since having my E I have had situations where I've had to drive over large hard objects, such as someone losing their cooler and after so many people driving over it, I got stuck driving over a decent chunk of it and I know it hit something underneath... but havn't had any issues with...

My question is where is this sensor located... and for a dealership to say you ran over something... I would think you would have noticed it...

Isn't this a sport utility vehicle so it should be able to handle every day road crumbs... such as coolers...
 
#9 ·
first, which dealer is giving you such a BS response? i want to know so that i can avoid them.

second, i agree with the above. go to the district rep, then honda (they're in torrance!), then a lawyer. its a defect, no matter how you slice it.
 
#10 ·
Thanks for the responses!

Hey!

Thanks for all the responses and suggestions. I will get in touch with the area supervisor for Honda and post how that goes. Again, if anyone knows any other element owners that this has happened to, please get them to go to the the NHTSA site and make that report so we can get this fixed.

Sorry for "spamming the other forums but I thought this was very important and wanted as many people to see it as possible. I'll remember to keep it to on next time.

Thanks again!

626e
 
#12 ·
626e said:
Hey!

Thanks for all the responses and suggestions. I will get in touch with the area supervisor for Honda and post how that goes. Again, if anyone knows any other element owners that this has happened to, please get them to go to the the NHTSA site and make that report so we can get this fixed.

Sorry for "spamming the other forums but I thought this was very important and wanted as many people to see it as possible. I'll remember to keep it to on next time.

Thanks again!

626e
Glad you and others have not been injured by these crazy deployments. Today is the first time I have ever heard of such a thing with the E, but now see a few last year posted here too. Hope it's not somehow related to the crazy clank or metal to glass sound that occurs now and then when you hit bumps in the road and turn into drvieways, etc... (probably not :confused: )

What dealer did you take it to here in SoCal? (I am very curious)

I specifically bought the model with side airbags because of the far superior safety rating they provide over the models that don't have them. Honda better get their act together on this one ASAP!!!

626e - THANKS FOR POSTING
 
#13 ·
And the lucky dealership is....

The dealer was Honda of Pasadena.

I have to be honest here, I really like this dealership outside of this problem. They where absolutely the most convienient place to buy the car that I have ever delt with. I got a great deal on the car. Their sevice of the vehicle has been first rate. Overall they have been very customer satisfaction oriented with good follow-up blah blah blah.

Even when I first brought this problem to their attention, they where very courtious and have continued to be so up to this point. It was when the factory was involved that it took a turn for the worst. It's my impression they are caught between the proverbial "rock and a hard place". I almost felt sorry for the service writer when he told me their position on the matter.

I'm very interested to see how this is going to pan out. I'll definitely keep you all posted on the shananagans!

626e
 
#133 ·
Take your HONDA to Robertson Honda in North Hollywood

The dealer was Honda of Pasadena.

I have to be honest here, I really like this dealership outside of this problem. They where absolutely the most convienient place to buy the car that I have ever delt with. I got a great deal on the car. Their sevice of the vehicle has been first rate. Overall they have been very customer satisfaction oriented with good follow-up blah blah blah.

Even when I first brought this problem to their attention, they where very courtious and have continued to be so up to this point. It was when the factory was involved that it took a turn for the worst. It's my impression they are caught between the proverbial "rock and a hard place". I almost felt sorry for the service writer when he told me their position on the matter.

I'm very interested to see how this is going to pan out. I'll definitely keep you all posted on the shananagans!

626e
WOW..this is so scary being that I drive off road every weekend on a very narrow cliff road. Glad you posted this!!
 
#14 ·
I guess I've been a retailer for too many years.

What does a guy have to do to get your respect?

I appreciate Honda of Pasadena was not able to work out getting you warranty service on this matter, but by your own admission, they've done everything right in this situation. They've done everything correctly in the purchase of your car, from being competitive on price to giving you great service (excluding this issue). They did their very best to take care of you up to the moment Honda said they wouldn't pay. You admit they were stuck between your wants and what Honda would authorize. They tried as hard as they could to make it right short of eating the $1,000 repair themselves. Is that what they had to do to not get castigated on this forum?

If that's the case, then I've been a retailer for too f*cking long.

I appreciate you're not happy. But don't shoot the messenger. They didn't build your car. They didn't make the airbag sensor. They didn't cause it to go off. All they tried to do was take care of you. Honda of Pasadena does not deserve being dragged through the mud on this.
 
#15 · (Edited)
This seems like a pile off rubbish to me. A spontaneous deployment of the side air bag? Gimme a frikkin break. It's a faulty sensor or something.

People drive over schit in there Elements everyday and this doesn't happen. And if you did hit something, then where's evidence of that?
Wouldn't there be a ding or a dent or some other indication that you hit or ran over something? Heck you were driving when it occured. The force of something hitting the vehicle would be obvious.

The dealership guys are guessing and grasping for straws. They know they are making excuses and hope you'll just lie down and accept cost. I sure as heck wouldn't. Plus this was a safety issue. You could of been in a serious accident by this air bag malfunction. Lucky for you that you weren't.

I have a friend that bought a new Murano and while the dealer was having an alarm system installed in her new car, the side airbags deployed. Kaboom! The interior of the roof buckled. What a mess! Over $1,500 in damage. The cause? The installer touched the wrong wire. It's not a pretty site to have one of these explosive air bag charges go off in your face. It's very frightening. I would insist Honda pay for it.

Side Air Bags are expensive which is my guess why they don't want to absorb the cost of replacing them. They would rather you do it for them.
 
#17 ·
626e -

Thank you. What puzzles me about the dealer issue is that some dealers are repairing it under warranty and other dealers are not :confused:

I had repeated repair issues with my 2000 VW Beetle Turbo. First the electric windows fell apart. VW made me pay for the repair. Then it was an electrical issue in the engine area. They made me pay for the repair. After VW became aware that these two items were wide spread, VW issued a recall AND reimbursed those who paid for the repairs prior to the "offical" recall. Hopefully Honda will do something similar for those that paid for the repair themselves prior to Honda researching the issue and stating their findings. We can only hope so at this point, because it is clear in my mind that this should be a warranty issue on these vitually new Elements that have posted here.

Best of luck to you and others regarding reimbursement. I personally would not drop the ball on such a serious issue as this and would take legal action if Honda turns it's back on you.
 
#18 ·
Replys to the comments...

First is outpost:

let me start by saying I still love the car. It's great & I'm keeping it! That's why I want it fixed.

You are correct stating that this dealer has done "what it can" and did it in a very professional manner. Service writers and managers spend countless hours training in customer service and handling difficult situations. Customer service is what makes the world go round now days. Ever heard of J.D.Powers? How many surveys did you get when you bought your Honda?
I am a manager for a medium sized builder here in So.Cal. and deal with customers on a daily basis and I know what good customer service is and what it isn't. That being said, their response to this problem was "professional" but it was not correct. Sometimes you just have to do what's right and in this situation they didn't.

The right thing to do would have been to repair the problem and here are the reasons why. Even if something did hit the sensor it should not have gone off. It should be designed to go off only in a side impact. There is no evidence of a side impact anywhere on my vehicle. Secondly, the sensor in question has obviously been located in a place that is succeptable being hit during normal driving circumstances. I know this to be true as that's all I've done. Lastly, if you are going to put it in such a place shouldn't it be protected from any sort of erronious impact? Just my humble opinion here but...Damn!

One last thing, do you think the dealer had any influence in the decision not to repair? They did do the inspection. They submitted the conclusion that something hit the sensor and caused it to deploy even though I told them I was driving on a smooth freeway when it happened and was hit by nothing. The dealer more or less chose to take a position just short of calling me a liar and sending me on my way to take care of it myself. This is a serious product defect and just dismissing it as my problem has only set my resolve to see that something is done to correct it.

Being a retailer yourself, you also know they are the people who sold me the car and in doing so have become a representative for Honda and it's products as well as my first line of contact with regard to the warranty of these products. The name of the business is HONDA of Pasadena not Joe's new cars...to me they are Honda not some messenger.

I'm not sure exactly what type of retailing you do but if the products you sold had the possibility of killing someone due to a poor design or function and one of your "customers" came to you with a situation that had put them in harms way using a product you sold them and represented as safe and you said it was their fault, you as a messenger would be deserving of a little castigation or mudd dragging!


MikeQBF & gfxguy,

no deep water. Normal Southern California weather. For 8 months. Mostly dry and hot. Some rain but no floods, lightning or tornado's just regular everyday driving.
 
#19 ·
I haven't seen any dragging in mud here. I see an owner with what I consider to be a serious problem, that is not their fault, that should be covered under the warranty, being told by a HONDA dealer, with whom they have done prior business, sorry, not our problem, not under warranty. That is NOT what I consider to be a proper response and all that was said was that the OPINION was that they were not offering good service upon being presented with THIS situation by THIS owner. IT'S AN OPINION!
I personally would be LIVID! This is not how I expect to be dealt with by HONDA and/or their authorized dealers. Can they show the so-called damage to the owner? I think not. This should be a no-brainer - this person could have been KILLED by this airbag (conveniently ERASING any record of the true cause of the loss of control BTW). Would Honda prefer the wrongful death/damage/injury lawsuit? Me-thinks the reason they are denying liability is due to possible legal actions in future cases. Would not be the 1st auto maker to pretend there isn't a problem to avoid expensive lawsuits.
The dealership is any owners 1st point of "contact" on such issues and thus is the initial responsible party for NOT fixing the defective airbag and sensor. Now it has escalated to Honda but the dealer was still the party who refused initial responsibility.
 
#20 ·
tango, I seriously doubt that Honda wished the customer dead as a result of the airbag deployment. I'll let that pass as a 3 AM post. Strange ghosts come out at 3 AM.

As for Honda shucking responsibility in this issue, that is self evident. I think they should fix the airbag under warranty in this situation. I said so in my first post in this thread. The responsibility to fix the car lies with them, not the dealer. The dealer is conduit in this matter. I do not see how they have "first responsibility." Their responsibility, if any, is last. Honda is the liable party here.

626e, you and I actually share many points of agreement. I'll get to the biggest of those shortly. One large possible disagreement still remains for me and that may simply be because I don't understand what you mean. You wrote, "their response to this problem was "professional" but it was not correct. Sometimes you just have to do what's right and in this situation they didn't." Please define "what's right" for me. I take that to mean Honda of Pasadena should have fixed your car themselves, paying for the repair. Is that what you meant?

You asked what retail I'm in. For thirty years I've been in retail consumer audio and video. Service issues come up all the time. One thing that's also similar with cars is they can be on expensive pieces where there is little profit. My store's biggest headache recently has been on an early HDTV video projector that has been a lemon. While it sold for $6,000 a number of years ago, we made maybe $500 in the initial sale. It has experienced multiple in and out of warranty defects. Our answer to this problem is to go to bat for the customer with the projector's manufacturer. We have been able to negotiate both cheap and free repairs on the unit. We have also paid for some of the incidental charges ourselves. It sounds like this is what you wanted Honda of Pasadena to do for you.

This said, I can't judge harshly Honda of Pasadena's attitude toward this repair. As both tango and you have said, they are HONDA to you, and sometimes, as a retailer, I just have to cop out to and parrot the company line. If a manufacturer tells me a customer's car amp is water damaged, it's water damaged. No protestations on his part will influence that decision or cause the manufacturer to fix it. The insistence that an impact caused the bag to go off could simply have been what the Honda service representative told Honda of Pasadena and they passed it along. If they are HONDA, then they have to back HONDA, as inappropriate or inaccurate that might be. I'd give Honda of Pasadena a pass on this. Not their best moment but very possibly one they could do little about. When it came to disciplining you as a child, I'm sure your mother always backed up your father and visa versa. It's the same thing here. You may not agree but one the rule has been made, that's the rule.

It wasn't until your last post that I realized you didn't have Honda of Pasadena fix the airbag, with you paying for it. Beyond I believe your whole airbag system is now non-functional, and therefore this is a safety issue, I also think this is a strategic mistake on your part. You, as the final consumer, have the greatest leverage in this matter. Get the bag fixed. I doubt you'll find another Honda dealer that will fix the bag under warranty now that Honda service has ruled against you. Then appeal the decision to the district service representative (I believe a different guy in the chain of command than the one who denied your service already). Get you paperwork together. Show through other posts on this site that this is a reoccurring problem that Honda has often fixed under warranty. Get a second Honda dealer - or even Honda of Pasadena - to document an impact never took place anywhere near the sensor (Getting Honda of Pasadena to do this would give them a chance to rehabilitate themselves. You could find, outside the constraints of Honda corporate, they might be very helpful to you. They certainly have the most to gain.). Continue your appeal to the NHTSA to have this problem documented. Put a lot of pressure on Honda. Honda has demonstrated multiple times in the past that the proverbial sticky wheel gets greased. Past experience has shown it will probably take a couple of months to get a refund on your repair but you look like just the guy to take this on as your mission.

You as the consumer have much more power than Honda of Pasadena ever had to get this covered under warranty. It may not be the right way to do business but it is the way it works. Companies respond to consumers. They can blow off a dealer.
 
#21 ·
outpost4 said:
tango, I seriously doubt that Honda wished the customer dead as a result of the airbag deployment. I'll let that pass as a 3 AM post. Strange ghosts come out at 3 AM.snip....
It doesn't matter what their INTENT was - you know that road to hell thing - the end result in THIS CASE (despite their "intent") there could very well have been a death or serious injury - both to the E's owner, and to anyone the vehicle impacted while out of control. No, I don't think any manufacturer sets out to build a hazardous, dangerous or defective automobile - they wouldn't be in business long if they did - but despite that, some manufacturers have indeed produced flawed, defective and yes, dangerous or deadly vehicles and sold them to the public. At that point it is then up to the manufacturer - with the help and support of their dealers, to quickly and efficiently repair such problems at no cost to the owners, providing no evidence of impact (like visible damage).
And as much as I like Honda I am not going to assume, nor be so naive to think, that they are the ONLY car company ever who has/will never negate and minimize serious hazards and/or defects in their vehicles to avoid costly lawsuits and findings of negligence or liability. Honda should "suck it up" immediately and issue a TSB for the life of the vehicle, check every sensor upon service or at owner request, as well as fix any E's that have an unexplained deployment of the airbag.
And caveat emptor - this is my humble opinion only.
 
#22 ·
i seriously disagree with outpost.

Honda of Pasadena should have been the lead advocate for the owner with HondaUSA. they should have inspected the car, and finding no impact, should have believed their customer's account of how the bag deployed. and then they should have gone to bat for him.

instead, they are now an impediment to getting HondaUSA to take it seriously with their bogus, made-up "explanation.
 
#23 ·
Loosing site of the Issue...

I would like to take a second and make something clear about my intentions here. I'm not looking for a villan! This seems to be turning into a debate about whether the dealer deserves or has any obligation to be held responsible for this. That is not the issue for me. I am an adult and I understand that this is how the process works. Again, it's not a problem until it becomes a problem. Well, at least from me, it's a problem!

Whether something did hit the sensor or not is irrelevent. It's a poor and dangerous design that needs to be addressed so it doesn't happen again with more serious results. I was just plain lucky that I wasn't injured or involved in an accident. If I can do something to keep someone else from being hurt, I'm going to do it. I know the circumstances my vehicle has been exposed to over it's time and there has been nothing out of the ordinary which means any Element with the same design has the same potential problem.

What I was hoping to do by posting here was to gather info from other E owners who may have either had the problem or knows of anyone who has and get them pointed to the NHTSA site to report it. Also to help inform the community of element owners that this problem exists. That's it.

I intend to follow the proper channels and see what comes of this. That means starting at the dealer and working my way up. As Outpost said, it's probably going to take some time to work out but I feel it's worth both the time and the effort.

I don't feel Honda would do anything to intentionally harm anyone. There is no evil conspiracy at work here. It's just how the process works. Perhaps they aren't aware of the number of times this has happened. I find this to be a bit unbelieveable as most people would assume this would be a warranty item and would return to the dealer no matter why it went off. Read the other posts and tell me this isn't true. I am more interested to see where it goes from here. Does H of A continue to assert it's my problem? Do they honestly look at the problem and fix it? Who knows...let's see!

I welcome your comments & suggestions and I'll try to be objective in my reports on how it's going.
 
#24 ·
Thank you for your post. It is a very serious issue and I am glad you made some of us aware of that situation. It should be recorded and would be a way for Honda to be aware of this possible dangerous situation. I can not imagine driving on the highway(65mph) and having my airbag deploy without warning. I think it is human nature to react and I am thinking if it was me I might have swerved and maybe even rolled the vehicle just from the instant shock and noise from the deployment. Thank you again and I would think if it is happening frequently Honda will recall the sensors before someone is seriously injured or killed. A recall may cost them but so will a huge lawsuit. Glad you are ok and around to share this important information...A positive note * you are around to pay for the damages!
 
#25 ·
626e said:
I would like to take a second and make something clear about my intentions here.
626e, you're the rarest of ducks - a truly alturistic one. I apologize for misjudging you. 30 years of retail have left me jaded and I looked at you though those eyes. My mistake and I'm sorry.

Good luck in your quest to make a better and safer Element. You deserve all of our support. You have mine. :)
 
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