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Valve Adjustment with pictures!

344K views 112 replies 65 participants last post by  kcr 
#1 ·
Tomorrow I will be adjusting my valves.

Today I took thing apart per the Helm manual.

Preparations Steps:

1. Turn steering wheel all the way to the right.

2. Remove intake manifold cover two 10mm bolts

3. Remove ignition coil cover four 10mm nuts

4. Remove ignition coils four 10mm nuts and four connectors.

5. Remove 2 10mm bolts securing vacuum lines on the right of the valve cover

6. Remove 1 10mm bolt securing P/S hose bracket on the back left of the valve cover

7. Move P/S hose to the left and the ignition harness to the back.

8. Remove the dipstick

9. Remove the breather hose on the right of the valve cover with pliers on the bracket and pull off nipple.

10. Remove 6 10mm nuts and washers from cylinder head cover.

11. Lift head cover straight up to take off.

12. Put 19mm ratchet on crankshaft bolt.

Here's pictues of what the result looks like:





 
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#2 ·
>Tomorrow I will be adjusting my valves.

:shock:

How come? 30K under the severe schedule. You have 30K already? And you drive it that hard?

For the non-techies here - valve adjustment normally comes at 110,000 miles.

(Doesn't look too bad, frankly. Let us know what you find on the starting clearances. I'm surprised that they don't remove the sparkplugs in the book procedure - makes turning the crank so much easier... and you're replacing the plugs anyway!)
 
#3 ·
Well this is an "after break-in embellishment". That's right I'm only at 10,000 miles and I didn't misread the book.

I like to set all the valves to "perfect", I adjusted the valves on my S2000 at 6,000 miles and the engine idled much better. I also like to be more precise than they may have been set at the factory. It only took me about 20 minutes to disassemble the valve cover. It won't take me long to adjust the valves. Plus I'm doing it to see what the valvetrain looks like. ;)

There are people with Gen1 CR-V's who had burnt exhaust valves for waiting to adjust their valves until 105,000 miles. I agree that 30,000 miles is reasonable for most people who want to do it early and not risk damage from waiting until 110,000 miles.

I'll report the actual settings of the valves later in the day and let you guys decide whether or not it was worthwhile. Just checking it is worthwhile to me cuz it doesn't take me long.

Here are some more pictures, first of the cam gears at #1 TDC, and second the place where the valves are adjusted.



 
#4 ·
Actually, this is the first time I ever adjusted valves without removing the spark plugs... I was afraid it would be too hard to turn, too. But it's easy if you take it slow.

P.S. our S2000's had a TSB for loose spark plugs, I also want to check that all the spark plugs are at least at up to the torque settings in the book. This is another one of those confidence-inspiring actions this Mechanical Engineer wants to do :shock:
 
#5 ·
Turning the crankshaft clockwise wasn't too bad. You turn it some and let the compression subside--you can hear a whistle it sneak past the rings. Then turn some more. When you get close to TDC on each cylinder it gets suddenly easy to turn, expect to have to turn back CCW a few degrees to get it exactly where it's supposed to be.

As for where I found the clearances, I'll report the largest feeler gage I could get between the tappet and valve without shoving:

#1 Int .008, .008; Exh .010, .011
#2 Int .009, .009; Exh .011, .011
#3 Int .010, .010; Exh .010, .011
#4 Int .009, .009; Exh .012, .011

The specification is:
Int .008-.010; Exh .011-.013.

When I was done adjusting, the settings were this:

#1 Int .009, .009; Exh .012, .012
#2 Int .009, .009; Exh .012, .012
#3 Int .009, .009; Exh .012, .012
#4 Int .009, .009; Exh .012, .012

I made sure a .010 and .013 would not go through.

Notice that I adjusted 11 of 16 valves, 9 of which were tight compared to the center of the specification, 2 were tight enough to be slightly out of specification.

One thing I don't know is whether or not (for the Element) valves get loose over time or tight over time. My experience between adjustments is that they can go either way. You don't have to worry too much about them getting loose, but tight valves can be very damaging because the valves are open when they shouldn't be.

I also checked the spark plug torque. All passed 18 N*m.

Putting things back together was more time consuming than taking them apart. Notably the valve cover was hard to get past all the stiff hoses which constantly tried to get in the way. But otherwise using a torque wrench and making sure everything was clean:

1. Clean valve cover seating surface and rubber gasket with non-chlorinated brake parts cleaner.

2. Apply Hondabond HT to four locations, two corners and timing chain cover interface with the head.

3. Remove washers and gaskets from 6 locations on the valve cover.

4. Put valve cover back on, carefully making sure you're not crushing anything (use a mirror) and that the spark plug seals are properly seating.

5. Put the gaskets and washers and nuts on the studs. Tighten in steps per the torque sequence in the Helm manual to 12 N*m.

6. Optional: Check spark plug torque to 18 N*m.

7. Install dipstick.

8. Replace breather hose.

9. Reinstall P/S hose bracket, torque the bolt to 12 N*m.

10. Reinstall vacuum line bracket, torque the two bolts to 12 N*m.

11. Replace ignition coils, torque the four bolts to 12 N*m.

12. Replace the spark plug cover, torque the four bolts/nuts to 9.8 N*m.

13. Replace the intake manifold cover, torque the two bolts to 12 N*m.

14. Wait at least 30 minutes before driving so the Hondabond HT can fully cure. Spend the time accounting for all your tools, checking over your work.

All together it took me 3 hours.

Based on what I experienced, I would definitely recommend having a valve adjustment done by 30,000 miles.
 
#7 ·
Now if it was me, I would have left the intakes alone since all were within tolerances (I know, you have it opened-up anyway).

However, that's very interesting on the exhausts... two were tight out of spec, with the rest 'cept one at the bottom of the tolerance range. What we need to know (but can't know) is what they were from the factory. If this is - at all - an indication that the trend is for the exhaust valves to tighten-up, then a 30K interval is perfectly reasonable even under normal service. I'm making mental note that it's going to need this at 30.

That compression behavior is exactly what you're supposed to get when hand-cranking. I've been lazy at times while chasing valve clatter and didn't bother with the plugs. Not to mention that one car I had which needed fairly frequent valve adjusts was a V8 with the front bank of plugs inaccessable without other disassembly.

Did you buy the special tool that's mentioned in the manual? Those look like every other Japanese design I've done the valves on - a box-end wrench and clean, sharp screwdriver are just fine.

(Oooooh... are my eyes deceiving me? Roller tappets? Way cool!)
 
#8 ·
Here's a list of the things I needed to do the job:

Helm shop manual
2- 3/8" Ratchets
10mm and 19mm sockets
10mm crescent wrench
3" and 6" extensions for 3/8" drive
Pliers (for breather hose)
Flat screwdriver
Torque wrench good up to 20 N*m
Handheld Mirror
Non-chlorinated brake cleaner
Hondabond HT or equivalent non-silicone gasket sealant
5/8" spark plug socket (to check the installation torque, didn't need to take them out)
 
#12 ·
engine ticking-clack clack clack....

Hi,

my elements engine at lithuania started to make a noisy noise that drives me crazy:)
good symptoms:
- no oil leak;
- no higher fuel consumption;
- same compression in each cylinder;
bad symptoms:
- high noise 'clack clack clack';

i am almost 95% shure that engine need valve adjustment, but my Element is in European country, and service station cant help me, as the car is manufactured in USA.
i read this article very carefully, but still have some questions:
1. What is "TDC"?
2. Which cylinder is the first one?
3. How those marks should be(or stand) when adjusting first cylinder? the second one and so on?
4. 0,009 those are inches? because we have here a different metric system...

thanks in advance...
 

Attachments

#13 · (Edited)
Cylinder # 1 is closest to the crank pulley. The firing order is 1,3,4,2

ONLY rotate the crankshaft in a clockwise direction - if you turn it backwards, you will compress the tensioner and run the risk of jumping the timing chain.

Valve Clearance
Intake: 0.21-0.25 mm (0.008-0.010 in.)
Exhaust: 0.28-0.32 mm (0.011-0.013 in.)

Line art Text Diagram Line Font



With cylinder # 1 on top dead center compression, the marks (C) on the exhaust (B) and intake (A) cams should look like this.
Auto part Drawing Automotive engine part Axle part
 
#14 · (Edited)
Rotate the crank 180 degrees clockwise (the cam pulleys will rotate 90 degrees), the next cylinder in the firing order is #3, so the marks will look like:
Auto part Line art Drawing Steering part Automotive engine part


Then #4:
Auto part Line art Steering part Automotive engine part Automotive window part



Then #2
Auto part Line art Drawing Circle Automotive engine part


Adjust to the loose side of the spec, I know you're trying to eliminate noise, but slappy valves are happy valves, and if you get the exhaust valves too tight when cold, they get so tight at operating temperature that you run the risk of burning them, which will make YOU very unhappy.
 
#15 ·
Q:

1. What is "TDC"?
2. Which cylinder is the first one?
3. How those marks should be(or stand) when adjusting first cylinder? the second one and so on?
4. 0,009 those are inches? because we have here a different metric system...

1: IS TOP DEAD CENTER ( TDC )

2: Number 1 is the first one on the left.

3: The marks must align for the first cylinder. There are 2 marks on the pulley on the crankshaft. You want the one on the left as you face it, looking down from the top. You will see the pointer mounted the block. At this point the 2 Punch marks on the timing gears will be at the top of the gear, If you are at Top dead center. There will also be 2 slots cut into the face of the same 2 gears. Those slots will be aligned, and next to each other. You woll see that the piston is at the top of the cylinder, and the lifters are not on the lobes of the cam's.

When No.1 is done, Rotate the crank shaft 180 deg. thats 90 deg. on the camshaft pulley, then do number 3 cylinder . Rotate the crank 180 deg. and do number 4 cylinder. Then rotate the crank 180 deg and do number 2 cylinder.

Each time make positive test to see that the piston is at the top of the cylinder, and the lifters are not on a high spot on the cam lobes.


Just to be clear, Every time you turn the crank shaft 180 degrees the cam gears will also turn only 90 degrees. That will insure that your at TDC for that Cylinder. I still like to double check it ! It may be over kill or lack in confidence . I've been doing it that way for over 45 years. I guess it's hard to teach an old dog new tricks!

Need more info? Just ask.

Dom
 
#16 ·
Just did my valves at 116,000. All the exhaust valves were .008 ish, tighter then spec. Carefully adjusted all of them. But there is still a bit of tappet noise.

To anyone thinking of doing it themselves:

It's not too difficult, no special tools needed. But I bought some feeler gauges that are already bent, and I used a home made tappet wrench. (10mm wrench bent at 45 angle in a vise).

Note, You have to remove the funny little cupped washers and the black gaskets holding down the cover, before trying to remove the cover. If you don't the thing will just not move.

I also changed plugs at same time. You'll need wrench extension, and spark plug socket with magnet or rubber insert.
 
#18 ·
Quick thought

I don't have the Helms manual for my Element, but I'm guessing it still advises that the adjustment be made with the engine/parts completely cool. I like to pull the valve cover and get everything ready at night and then let the car sit in the garage over night and tackle the adjustment first thing in the morning.

I think this thread has become more relevant to all the posters who seem to be having issues with a dying engine. The two common problems seem to be valves that are out of adjustment and a dirty throttle body. With 60K on a 2007 EX that is experiencing the same engine stall, I'll be tackling this valve adjustment soon in order to prepare the car for the upcoming road trip from CA to CO.

Good luck!
 
#21 · (Edited)
A few members have reported rough idle and poor running.....fixed after a valve adjustment.

There have been 1 or 2 reports (that I can remember) of burned valves and valve/head replacement being required. The amount of info and details of those situations are sketchy and limited unfortunately.

I do know that repair of a damaged valve train/head due to misadjusted valves is "involved." (read:expensive) I also feel that a simple check is relatively easy to do, so a bit of maintenance every 100k or so could save a decent amount of money for someone who plans on keeping their E for a long time.

There was lots of mis-information floating around, comparing the E with the similar CR-V and its "famous burnt valve synmdrome." Earlier CR-Vs used a different motor (B series) that did have some valve problems, but they are very different from the K motor in the Element. (the K is also used in 2002(?) and newer Cr-Vs.)

Also, I spoke with someone w/ a K motor CR-V the other day who said the local dealer charged only $150 for the valve check. I mentioned high numbers before because that is all I'd heard at that point. I've never been to a dealer for service, so I don't have any real experience w/ their pricing. I'd say that $100-$150 or so is plenty reasonable. (especially when ya only gotta pay it every 100k!)
 
#22 · (Edited)
I did mine for the second time this past weekend. It is just short of 115k miles.

I did first check around 55k. It was just an inspection, i didn't have to mess w/ anything. All the valves were in spec, one or two were near the tight end of the range, but still ok.

This time they were all "tight." None were dangerously tight, and a few were at the tight end of the acceptable range, but I adjusted every single valve, intake and exaust. They're all very much at the loose end of the range, and are plenty quiet.

I'll check again around 160-170k miles and let ya'll kow what happens.

Also, I don't remember seeing it mentioned here or in the service manual, but I think it is a lot easier to remove the P/S hose from the pump and tuck it off to the side to allow better access to the valve cover. Last time I scuffed the valve cover w/ the metal ring on the hose pulling the cover off. This time I removed those 2 screws (use the same 10mm tool as you use on all the other fasteners), pulled it straight up & out, and stuffed a rag in the p/s pump hole. It made things much easier.
 
This post has been deleted
#23 ·
This just doesn't seem right. If these cars really needed valve adjustments every 30,000 miles, why don't they say so in the manual? This is not what I've come to expect from Honda.

FWIW...(this is just my opinion, and worth what you pay for it) I don't think an adjustment is necessary with the K motors before 100k miles. Most have no problem at all going to 100k.

However, I do think it it worthwile to check them early, say around 50,000 or 60,000 miles just in case. If no adjustment is required, it is a fairly quick and simple procedure....that can save lots of money and trouble in the long run. If they are found to be out of spec, and adjustment can be made before any damage is done.
 
#26 · (Edited)
what is the procedure for adjusting the clearances. I just want to make sure this is clear to me before I start
see the 4th post of this thread for a picture.

You slip the feeler guage in there....try seveal sizes to find out what your clearance is. If it is "off" you need to loosen the locking nut and then turn the adjuster w/ a flat blade screw driver. (or use the special tool) Loosen or tighten the adjuster to get the "gap" correct. The correct size feeler guage should have some slight "drag" when inserted, but shouldn't flop around or be tight or need to be "jammed" into place.

Now hold the adjuster w/ the screwdriver and tighten the locking nut back down tight. Recheck the gap. Don't be surprised if it changed....loosen up and try again.

By the time you get to the last valve or two you'll have the hang of it. :twisted: Don't worry, it ain't as hard as it sounds. You'll have some trouble with the first few valves, but it goes much easier and quiccker once you get used to it.

Godd luck, have fun. ;-)

Will
 
#28 · (Edited)
Yes, the gauge must be square on to give you a true feel. That's why folks recommend the angled gauges.

Throwing in a tidbit: valve cover torque sequence.



Adjustment nuts are 10mm.

Torque
Exhaust: 10 ft. lbs. / 120 inch lbs. / 13.6 Newton meters / 138 kilogram centimeters / 1.38 kilogram meters
Intake: 15 ft. lbs. / 180 inch lbs. / 20.3 Newton meters / 207 kilogram centimeters / 2.07 kilogram meters
 
#29 ·
With the help of this thread and a factory service manual, I did the valve adjustment and spark plug replacement for the first time on my 05 EX with 92,500 miles.

I learned some interesting things in the process.

1. I would never make it as a flat rate mechanic. I probably spent 6 or 7 hours in the process, but it will take much less time next time.

2. I should have done it sooner as all valves, intakes as well as exhaust were at 8 or 9 thousands except for #4 cylinder where the intakes were at 6 and 7. Now all intakes are at 9 or 10 and exhausts are at 12 or 13.

3. The cams appeared to be in excellent condition with no pitting or brinelling. I have used Castrol Syntec 5-20 since break-in.

4. It's sort of a fiddely (tech term) process to get them right as the adjustment screws have a fairly course thread pitch an .001 inch doesn't take much of a turn to the screw.

5. Because of what I learned about the clearances I will now check them more often, perhaps every 50 K or so.

6. Next I will do the 07 Accord SE with 77,000 miles on it and see what's going on with them.

7. I was very impressed with the way the valve train was built, particularly the roller cam followers etc. I have adjusted valves on a lot of Mercedes, BMWs and Porsches over the years and none of them had roller cam followers.
 
#30 ·
I adjusted mine last year (very slightly out of spec but since I was in there I adjusted them all from scratch anyways) and I know a few of the exhaust ones are a pain to get at due to their proximity to the cylinder head walls and the rocker assembly posts. Being a shorter guy at just under 5'8", it was a fun time reaching to the back to get them just right. I'm picky so I found myself doing some of them a couple times over to ensure they were within specification.

Someone said the adjusters do not turn when tightening the jam nut and I beg to differ :razz:. I've performed a couple Maintenance Minder 4 services (timing belt, water pump, valve adjustment, spark plugs) on Ridgelines and Odysseys and I had to press down on the rocker to keep the adjuster from turning when tightening the jam nut. Nothing worse than getting the adjustment within spec only to see it turn when tightening the nut :roll:.
 
#31 ·
Great Write up!
Thanks for that!

I've got good news and bad news...
The good news is that I made it through the valve adjustment @ 116k and it was over due for sure. the exhaust on the #2 & #4 were Very tight. It comes recommended from me.

The bad news is that I broke an bolt while reinstalling the valve cover.
Can anyone help me identify the part number I need to replace? I'm hoping that I don't have to pull the valve cover to replace this. if i'm lucky I can unscrew from the top side with Vice grips and replace.
Thoughts?





 
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