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Old 04-27-2019, 10:22 PM   #1
bongobennie
EOC Rank: Hydrogen
2008 2WD EX AT
Alabaster Silver Metallic (ASM)
 
Join Date: Oct 2016
Posts: 42
6 speed owners, opinion wanted.

I have purchased a new (used) manual trans and will be doing a thorough rebuild including adding LSD, carbon synchros & 6th gear

First and most common option is TSX 6th which is .659 but there are a few other options I am considering.

Second option would be using the RSX-S 6th which is .738. Element 5th is .825 so it's just not such a far reach as TSX (maybe some thing the TSX is a bit high?).

The third option would be to use the 05 Si 5th .738 and tsx 6th .659 which is basically like the first option but skipping 4th instead of 5th. I had a K24a2 swapped EP3 with a Type S/TSX 6th trans and after 200K miles of driving I wished I had done something like this instead. Since this trans will cost over $3K when done and is rather permanent I thought I would run this by anyone who might have an opinion from their experience. Thank you in advance and added the stock ratios for reference.


1st: 3.533

2nd: 2.042

3rd: 1.355

4th: 1.028

5th: 0.825

Final Drive: 4.765
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Old 04-27-2019, 11:13 PM   #2
ianmel22
EOC Rank: Hydrogen
2005 4WD EX AT
Galapagos Green Metallic (GGM)
 
Join Date: Feb 2018
Location: Florida
Posts: 47
Subscribed! I’m very interested in your thread. I want to do something similar on my 03 DX. I’m still looking for a donor E/CRV 5MT. FWIW I plan on using the RSX-S top gear, it seams like a more reasonable step.
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Last edited by ianmel22; 04-27-2019 at 11:16 PM.
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Old 04-27-2019, 11:59 PM   #3
bongobennie
EOC Rank: Hydrogen
2008 2WD EX AT
Alabaster Silver Metallic (ASM)
 
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Posts: 42
Quote:
Originally Posted by ianmel22 View Post
FWIW I plan on using the RSX-S top gear, it seams like a more reasonable step.
The way I used to describe my car to the layman was that it didn't have a 6th gear but skipped it and went to 7th. Using that logic I came to a conclusion and said that I would have rather skipped 5th as it was the least used gear, in that car however I was running a swap with more torque AND a higher redline to go with the extra HP whereas with the Element not sure where I'm going to take the engine mods just yet (I have other cars to go fast in).
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Old 04-28-2019, 01:29 AM   #4
ianmel22
EOC Rank: Hydrogen
2005 4WD EX AT
Galapagos Green Metallic (GGM)
 
Join Date: Feb 2018
Location: Florida
Posts: 47
TSX 04-08 gear ratio

1st: 3.266
2nd: 1.88
3rd: 1.355

4th: 1.028

5th: 0.825

6th: 0.659
Final Drive: 4.765

Differences are in bold. TSX (also the same as 06-11 civic si) 6th gear may be a good choice
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03 DX(SSM)MT | 03 EX (SSM) AT | 05 EX (GGM) AT 4WD | 03 EX (EBP) AT, Pilot steering wheel, delay wipers mod, rear FRANKEN-STRUT 1” lift, front TSX brake mod

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Old 04-28-2019, 07:10 PM   #5
nacranym
EOC Rank: Neon
2004 2WD EXS 6MT
Galapagos Green Metallic (GGM)
 
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: San Diego
Posts: 2,666
the .659 for sixth seems like the right choice. my Element can still manage some slight upgrades in 6th and ~2700 rpm at 70 mph keeps the engine buzz to a reasonable level. downshifting into 5th is about the same as 5-4, 4-3, 3-2 downshifts as far as throttle blip.
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Old 04-29-2019, 09:25 PM   #6
KargoMaster
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Location: Cincinnati, OH USA
Posts: 83
Agree with nacranym... the “delta” (difference in between gears) gets a little wonky if you were to swap out the Element 5th year... 4-5 or even 5-4 might be a bigger jump than comfortable... or proportional to the rest of the set..?

Having mine back on the road for only weeks after years long hiatus, I put 6th in to lower revs... driving style aside... I’m not looking for every drop of efficiency, otherwise I wouldn’t have selected a block of a vehicle... if 5 gears are good, 6 gears have to be better...

Might I like a *little* more pull of the .738 gear? Maybe... but the idea was to bring down the revs... Do I feel like 6th gear wants to be let loose around 80? Probably...
Am I glad I did it, absolutely...

Your mileage may vary... good luck with your build!
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Old 05-01-2019, 07:43 AM   #7
Elemental Guy
EOC Rank: Helium
2004 4WD LX MT
Nighthawk Black Pearl (NBP)
 
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Posts: 104
Quote:
Originally Posted by KargoMaster View Post
Agree with nacranym... the “delta” (difference in between gears) gets a little wonky if you were to swap out the Element 5th year... 4-5 or even 5-4 might be a bigger jump than comfortable... or proportional to the rest of the set..?

Having mine back on the road for only weeks after years long hiatus, I put 6th in to lower revs... driving style aside... I’m not looking for every drop of efficiency, otherwise I wouldn’t have selected a block of a vehicle... if 5 gears are good, 6 gears have to be better...

Might I like a *little* more pull of the .738 gear? Maybe... but the idea was to bring down the revs... Do I feel like 6th gear wants to be let loose around 80? Probably...
Am I glad I did it, absolutely...

Your mileage may vary... good luck with your build!
I've asked this question before here of those now driving with the 6th gear (and incredibly have never gotten a straight answer): how does your highway mileage compare cruising in sixth as opposed to cruising in fifth when fifth was the top gear you had? Like, my E buzzes at 3700 at 70 and I can occasionally get around 28 mpg. Doing the math, if I could shift to a sixth gear and do 2700 at 70, that sounds like gas mileage in the mid to upper 30s. But I'm not the one driving a sixth gear.
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Old 05-02-2019, 01:47 AM   #8
nacranym
EOC Rank: Neon
2004 2WD EXS 6MT
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mid 30's is not going to happen. one still has to use other gears before one is going fast enough to use 6th. and the wind resistance is going up with the cube of the speed and starts becoming very significant by 50 mph, which is a good target minimum speed for 6th gear.
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Old 05-02-2019, 05:55 AM   #9
Elemental Guy
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nacranym View Post
mid 30's is not going to happen. one still has to use other gears before one is going fast enough to use 6th. and the wind resistance is going up with the cube of the speed and starts becoming very significant by 50 mph, which is a good target minimum speed for 6th gear.
I was thinking more in terms of using the 6th when having to cruise at 75 for hours. Surely shifting up and revs dropping would result in higher mpg in that scenario?

As it is, I can drive around town in 5th my E is geared so dam low...of course I don't but it's possible. 5th at 45 in the city, 5th at 80 driving in Utah, it's an all purpose gear!
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Old 05-03-2019, 09:47 PM   #10
nacranym
EOC Rank: Neon
2004 2WD EXS 6MT
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Location: San Diego
Posts: 2,666
Quote:
Originally Posted by Elemental Guy View Post
I was thinking more in terms of using the 6th when having to cruise at 75 for hours. Surely shifting up and revs dropping would result in higher mpg in that scenario?

As it is, I can drive around town in 5th my E is geared so dam low...of course I don't but it's possible. 5th at 45 in the city, 5th at 80 driving in Utah, it's an all purpose gear!
the new 6th is another all purpose gear, 6th at 50 in the city, 6th at 80 on the highway, assuming no hindrances by law enforcement. and the all purpose 6th gear has fewer engine RPMs at any given speed, which generally means better MPG.
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