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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Great site, thanks for all the info. I'm installing this Pioneer with a XM module in a 2010 EX AT (factory XM, no Nav). The AVIC has sub left and right RCA outputs with control. I have the Crutchfield Honda connector 120 70-1729 and faceplate and swi interface. Despite scouring here, AVIC411, and other sites, a few questions remain.

1) I want to use the AVIC to power the 4 speakers and use the factory amp and sub. Using BigAl205's suggestion to splice an RCA input into the OEM amp harness, will that work? His advice on balanced/unbalanced line-level input had me concerned I might be sending a 4v load into a 8v input, or is that just relevant to the front/rear speakers? I could replace the amp and sub speaker (I have to maintain factory appearance for her sake) but it feels like throwing good money after bad- utilizing that small enclosure.
2) In bypassing the OEM amp to the front/rear speakers, is there a Metra harness that lets me connect them cleanly or is splicing my only alternative? Judging from the confusing conversations, I take it the 70-1721 and 1725 are for hooking up the H/U to the amp.
3) Will my amp turn-on lead power 2 devices (amp and antenna)? Most seem to think it will but I don't want to fry this thing right off the bat. Or is a relay my best route?
4) Has anyone found an adapter(s) to hook up the factory AM/FM/XM antenna to aftermarket XM (Pioneer GEX-P920XM)? Installer.com said theirs would not work. It looks like I can splice into B1-B2 leads for XM and E1-E2 leads for AM/FM, but would rather not.
5) I'm hoping from yicng's success in the 'VSS wire' post that the ECM/PCM connector E, pin 26 will be my tap-in for the VSS lead.
Any other comments or suggestions will be appreciated.

Thanks to everyone that contributes, I've learned a ton already. I was hoping to get everything in order before I tear this apart as it's a surprise birthday gift for the woman's new EX. I've done enough installs to know a quick installation is a relative term, but you can always hope. Hopefully this is a one six-pack installation, because after that it becomes inversely difficult no matter the simplicity of the task (can't hold 'em like I used to).
 

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Don't forget your powered Honda antenna adapter (Metra 40-HD10).

1. Yes, splicing a male RCA on the sub harness will work just fine. Doesn't matter which output (L or R) you use from the AVIC, but you only need one hooked up.

2. Metra makes the 70-1726 amp bypass harness that plugs into the output harness of the amp and has long wires to run up to the headunit to the speaker outputs. Their website lists this as 2003-2009, so either they haven't updated their compatibility yet, or Honda changed the amp/plug for 2010. Someone else can chime in if they know. However, if the sub output is also part of this harness, you may have some trouble since you want to bypass the amp for the door speakers, but still use it for the sub. That may require some extra splicing and probably an extra OEM-side plug since you'll still need the sub output connected to the amp.

3. Yes, you can power 2 devices, but your AVIC should have a dedicated antenna turn-on lead (only on when radio is being used) and another amp turn-on lead (on all the time the head unit is on).

4. No off-the-shelf adapter I'm aware of, but some people on here have made custom adapters to use their OEM XM antenna.

5. Good luck with VSS. I have an '07, so I'm outta luck, but maybe the newer models have a better source to tap into. However, without a VSS hooked up, my navigation still works really well.
 

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Discussion Starter · #3 ·
Thanks Texas, I already thought about the dilemma with the sub-out harness. Guess I'll cross that bridge when I get there, unless anyone out there has one they removed and want to sell....???

I was rooting around in the wire bin last night and found some XM antenna connectors, but those are some tough wires to work with- especially that center conductor! It's almost as small as the print in the Pioneer manuals. But my spirits came down a bit after seeing the diagram in the Bad XM post today where the XM receiver is located (in the rear-i.e. more wire routing, dangit).

I installed a AVH-P3200BT in my Tundra last night (Amazon has 30% off select Pioneer gear till today!), all went well- well.. almost. But after reading the instructions for that one I'm wondering if I will have a sub out on the AVIC920. The 3200 has front/rear speaker output in the harness and RCA out for front and rear, but it says the rear RCA can be used as a sub-out direct to the speaker. I'm wondering if I'd lose the rear out in the harness if I go that route- ughhh. Back to the microscopic manuals.
 

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The '09 and later Elements have a VSS once again. It is on connector E on the ECU, pin 26. Another user here already confirmed his Non-Navi E had the VSS wire. '07 and '08 owners got screwed. Do Pioneer head units still require a VSS connection?
 

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my vss wire is not hooked up in my 2004 Lx. I have a pioneer x910bt installed (love it). I also did the bypass hardware hack on the wiring harness.
 

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Discussion Starter · #6 ·
my vss wire is not hooked up in my 2004 Lx. I have a pioneer x910bt installed (love it). I also did the bypass hardware hack on the wiring harness.
In your install, did you use the harness speaker leads for your speakers or the RCA outputs? And now many speakers are you running? What I gather from the X920bt manual is the RCA rear speaker output can be used as the sub power directly (with the selectable subsonic filter, bypass frequency ranges, output, etc.). So I'm wondering if I use that will I lose the rear speaker output in the harness? I may just hook it up on the bench and test it first if no one here knows. I've scoured everywhere else and haven't found out yet.

Hillstones- thanks. It was your thread in the 'VSS wire' post (and ycing's confirmation) that finally answered my question about the VSS wire. There's so much conflicting info out there I started getting sensory overload. Sorry the 07-08's are screwed. I know I can do without it, but a few AVIC's have had problems that didn't use it, and I'd much rather do it right the first time around.

Now if I just don't run into the same problem as my Tundra. I remove my facepiece instead of letting it hang (and possibly get scratched). But apparently when you disconnect the passenger airbag harness (or HVAC controls), it interrupts the acc. power lead to the radio. So when I tested the radio before reconstructing the dash, my unit wouldn't power on. I tried the old radio, still no power. After checking EVERY fuse in the truck and attemping to trace the line- nothing. Two hours later it hit me like an epiphany. Plugged in the 2 facepiece harnesses and whaa-laa, all systems go. Boy did I feel stupid! Hopefully no Elemental surprises when I get to this install!!
 

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So I'm wondering if I use that will I lose the rear speaker output in the harness?
I'm fairly certain the answer is no, you do not lose the full range rear speaker level outs when configuring the RCA rear outs for sub only operation. Now I haven't hooked up the AVIC like this, but other head units I've installed in the past kept all four speaker level outputs operational when using the preamp outs for sub only.
 

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Hey nukl, not sure if you have already installed this or not, but it should be a pretty straight forward install. Metra sells a harness 70-1725 that allows you to use the factory amp with no need to bypass. You would you the front and rear rca outputs on the back of the Avic for your interior speakers, and then splice your sub out into the sub wire. This will give you control of everything while using the factory equipment with no need to change anything. This is how mine is setup and it sounds awesome. I can even control my sub out and turn it off if need be. Good luck!
 

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Sorry, just noticed that you think your unit might only have 2 sets of preouts with the rear being rear/sub selectable. What I would do is still get the 70-1725, and buy 2 1Male/2Female splitters. Then wire up the front out channel so that you are splitting the signal. You will plug in one splitter to your left front, and the other to right front. Then just plug in Front Left and Rear Left to the Left output, and Front Right and Rear Right to the Right output. This will give you all your interior speakers running off your front preamps. The only issue with this is you will not be able to fade front to rear. Then just use your rear for the sub and select sub in the menu. This is really the only way to do it with using the factory amp if your unit only has 2 preamp outputs. That or go buy a higher end unit with 3 outputs.

Also as far as losing your high level outputs with switching rear/sub, that won't happen. The high level outputs of the radio are always active and always front & rear, only the preamp is selectable.
 

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Discussion Starter · #11 · (Edited)
Thanks Boon, I finally got the unit in so I'm learning first hand what I'm dealing with. But until I actually pull the OEM stereo, I'm still in the air about the factory H/U and amp harnesses. There's 2 harnesses with the AVIC, the main has the 8 speaker leads which hook-up to the factory harness (although the OEM H/U sent a line-level signal) and the second has front/rear/and sub RCA's (along with the video RCA's) with a line-level signal. My previous assumptions about the rear/sub output was based on my P3200BT and info from the web, it doesn't apply to the AVIC. I would still like to use the Pioneer H/U for the f/r speakers and the sub-out RCA to the factory amp/sub. Does the Metra plug into the factory amp? The product description only says "plugs into existing factory wiring". I thought the AVIC's amp would be stronger and cleaner that the OEM amp, which is why I wanted to bypass it for the speakers. But it would be a helluva lot easier going your route!
 

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Ok, so the new unit has Front, Rear, and Sub which is perfect. You basically have the same set up as me except mine is Kenwood. Basically what you want to do is use the 70-1725 harness. What you will do is just connect the RCA's from the 70-1725 right to the RCA output on the radio. There is no need to use the 8 wires (which is just front/rear left/right positives and negatives) basically they are exactly the same. You won't get any benefit by bypassing the factory amp and using the high level outputs. Just the opposite you will not get as good of sound and you will have a bunch more work to do. Here is a perfect write up of exactly what you need to do.

http://www.elementownersclub.com/forums/showthread.php?t=52097

Follow those instructions and you will be good to go.
 

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as stated already, you need a 70-1725 harness and to hook the sub up according to big al's instruction and you will be fine. your radio will work without the vss hooked up, but it will be better (less jerky icon movement) with it.

the 2010 element shows the 70-1726 now on the metra site. You would only use this if you were going to bypass it and power things off a seperate amp of the deck itself, but you cant power everything off the pioneer deck. i personally wouldnt power even the factory sub off the "bridgeable" outputs of a pioneer deck. they have been doing that for years, and it really isnt a good route to go, IMHO.

i have a sub plug prototype that i could send you to use instead of wiring it up like al has by tapping into the wiring, but you have to have everything thing else first and ready to install it.
 

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Discussion Starter · #14 ·
Thanks for the info and offer Yoda. I'm still a few weeks out from the install and my plans seem to change daily. It's going to be a surprise for my girlfriend's birthday on Aug. 23rd, so I still have time to plan. The easy way out is the 70-1725 and use the Honda amp. I looked at the 70-1726 and balked at $60 for a harness. She will drive this car till it drops so I have no aversion to splicing wires, saving the money on the harnesses, and drop in a decent mono amp and new sub (athough a 6.5" sub isn't my idea of spurging). But, would another couple hundred dollars be worth it versus $20 for a harness with the original amp/sub. Sheesh, I miss the good ol' 8 track days sometimes, 6 wires and you're done!
 

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Antenna Adapter Blue Wire?

This is my first stereo install, and I am trying to put the X920BT in a 2006 EX-P using the 70-1725 to integrate the factory amp. Thanks to a lot of help from the EOC boards, I am almost done with the connections. I do have a question about the blue antenna adapter wire and how it relates to the blue/white wires on both the Metra and Pioneer harnesses. I have read on the forum that the blue/white wire on the Pioneer harness (System Remote Control) should connect to the blue/white wire on the Metra harness (Amp Turn-On). The AVIC manual says the blue/white wire should go to the auto-antenna relay control terminal. Does connecting the blue/white wires accomplish this? If so, then what happens to the blue wire coming from the antenna adapter? I don't have any other blue wires or antenna wires coming from either the Pioneer or Metra harness. Would I have to connect three wires together? Thanks for any info you might have.
 

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Normally aftermarket radios have both a blue and blue and white coming
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off of them. The blue is normally for powered antenna and will only turn on when you are listening to your tuned (am/fm). If your radio does not have blue then just tie it with the blue/white and your good to go. Like you said you will have all three wires tied together. Hope this helps........
 
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