[Holsch2]

2006 AWD MT 6 speed conversion

I have a couple of quick questions for anyone who has the time to respond. I am planning on doing this mod soon (hopefully) and I have read through a lot of the posts but feel there is some conflicting information on at least two subjects. I have seen comments that state that you DO need the 5-6 synchro if you don't want it slipping out of 6th in the long run, but I also (I believe it was rhurt), said his 5-6 was hanging up as a wall decoration. Second topic: shims. I can't really afford to have this vehicle down any longer than necessary, so I want to make sure that I order anything I would possibly need so I am not scrambling for parts to complete it. (I am tentatively thinking that I would not need the shift fork for my year element because I believe it has the pin connection rather than welded but please tell me if I am incorrect on this). Thank you in advance for any help or advice

 

[mikesee]

Would low MTF cause or contribute to this?

Drained and refilled today @ dealership. Road tripping for the long weekend--will know on Friday AM if this helped.

Put on a few hundred miles over the long weekend, including lots of time in 6th. No reoccurrences, even when intentionally lugging it up a few hills. Seems solid now.

Thanks for the advice/suggestions.

 

[nacranym]

Hmmm. Mine was flawless for 110,000+ miles, and is only intermittently problematic now. Seems unlikely that this would be the root cause.

mine was flawless for about 160000 miles, and then it was done.

 

[MiguelATF]

I realize it may be sacrilege to ask but - for those who are mechanical morons but still would like to convert an Element 5MT to a 6MT and live on the west coast, and specifically in Oregon - are there any good mechanics or shops who could handle the conversion ... for a semi-reasonable price?

 

[SameGuy]

I'm not a mechanical moron but this seems like something a little more than I'm willing to tackle, so same question but for eastern Canada (preferably greater Montreal area to a radius of about 200 miles). Perhaps it's been answered in the last 550 or so posts, but roughly what hands-on shop time can be expected for a mechanic with MT experience?

 

[liteyouup]

I paid $1,100 for the job, with parts, installed, but I don't remember if he already had the motor out for rebuild or if that was the only thing we did. If I remember right the parts only cost $2-300. Somebody may remember more details here.

 

[Watt-man]

The parts cost me $483, and that also included a throw-out bearing. This is listed in post #543 (on page 55). You'll note that almost half of that was on the 5-6 synchronizer, and rumor has it that the early E's (like SameGuy's) might not need it.

 

[Dr. Smiles]

6MT

Nice to meet you guys.
I'm new to the forum, my name is Chad. I just got back stateside and lucked out on an 07 SC manual. I've read through the majority of the posts and I'm going to convert mine to a 6spd in the next few weeks. Would you mind a couple questions?
-priced the parts at a dealership (mistake) and was quoted a $1000. I almost slapped the guy when he told me out of defensive reflex. Can you recommend a good place to order the parts?
Thanks in advance.

 

[ramblerdan]

Welcome, Dr. Smiles.

Threads merged. No need for a new thread.

 

[e4u2c]

6MT conversion question for 2006 AWD

Hello,

I have an '06 EX-P AWD, S/N 003050, does anyone know if I really need the 5-6 synchronizer set? I have found all the parts I think I need, are there any special tools that I will need? Is there anything else I should do while I'm in there? I have a new Exedy clutch kit ready.

Any suggestions would be greatly appreciated.

 

[nacranym]

you either need the 5-6 synchro or you don't.
consider the scenarios:
1) you don't use a new 5-6 synchro and everything works out fine forever
2) you don't use a new 5-6 synchro and it works for awhile but then it dies
3) you don't use a new 5-6 synchro and it just doesn't work.
if you don't find prize #1 behind the door you open, the transmission has to come out again. if you like removing and replacing transmissions and you feel lucky, don't bother with a new 5-6 synchro and save a few hundred dollars.

 

[asp]

Another planned 6MT conversion

Greetings.

I've been reading this thread on and off for some time now. My thanks and admiration to everyone for creating and contributing to this thread. I've wanted to do this modification for years, but didn't do it last time I had the transmission out to replace the clutch after 320,000km. Well, recently, at 385,000 km, the ball bearing (91001-PPP-005) and oil seal (91216-PHR-003) failed on my 2004 5MT AWD. They fit over the MT mainshaft and are seated in the MT clutch case. Apparently, these parts fail commonly on Honda MT's. Unfortunately, the MT fluid leaked out sufficiently to contaminate the clutch friction disk as the clutch was slipping at high rpm's. As the disk had little wear on it, I was contemplating cleaning the disk with some brake clean and gentle heat, but was warned it's not worth the risk, and to just get a new disk, which I did.

I have a home made engine support, which works well. I also have the honda ball joint separator tool, so I have managed to avoid some of the difficulties noted in this and associated threads. I don't have a transmission jack, and it is unnecessary as I used a wooden beam and a couple of cable straps to support and lower the MT safely by myself. I've done this twice now, and the second time was definitely easier. The first time I tried to separate the ball joints, using a variety of methods and tools, I damaged the threads on a ball joint, but was lucky enough to successfully refresh the threads with a suitable die. After that episode, I caved and bought the Honda tool.

So, the transmission is out, and I have all the parts I need to repair it, but don't have the parts for the 6MT conversion. I thought that it's a waste of sorts not to add the sixth gear capability while everything is apart, right? I'm not overly concerned with the economic payback, but just want to do the modification because it's awesome and I've always wanted a 6MT; cost-benefit analysis be damned!

Parts list and some questions to follow.

 

[asp]

confirmation of 6MT parts and questions

I reviewed the parts listings in this thread and used the Majestic Honda website at HondaAutomotiveParts.com for the 2006 Civic SI to produce my parts list here. Even with the insane exchange rate for USD to CAD, it's still about half price to buy the parts in the States. I'm travelling stateside soon, and so will pre-order everything and pick it up there and save on shipping. If anything is on backorder, they can ship it. I'm not in a big hurry as I have a back up car, but if the wait is significant, I will just do the conversion another time.

23916-PNS-000 COLLAR, DISTANCE (28X35X24)
24240-PNS-000 PIECE, REVERSE SHIFT
24430-PNS-000 INTERLOCK
90011-PPP-000 BOLT, SPECIAL (20X25)
23491-RAS-000 GEAR, COUNTERSHAFT SIXTH
23592-RPN-305 GEAR SET, MAINSHAFT SIXTH
24412-PNS-000 ARM, MAINSHAFT BRAKE SYSTEM
24413-PNS-000 SPRING, MAINSHAFT BRAKE SYSTEM RETURN
23626-PNS-315 SLEEVE SET, SYNCHRONIZER (5-6)
24201-PNS-010 FORK, GEARSHIFT (5-6)

Notes:

1) the mainshaft sixth gear set is just a combination of 23590-RAS-A00 GEAR, MAINSHAFT SIXTH and 91103-PNS-003 BEARING, NEEDLE (35X40X24); it's just cheaper buying as a set than buying separately.

2) the gearshift fork (5-6) is only necessary if the existing gearshift piece is welded to the existing reverse shift piece; I will disassemble the MT to check if this is the case before I order it.

3) I'm ordering the synchronizer (5-6) sleeve set; I want to reduce the risk of a transmission failure.

4) I'm still not sure about ordering the MBS arm and return spring parts, as it was unclear to me, even after reading the relevant threads, whether or not these MBS parts served any function. Should I get these?

Thanks

 

[antness]

what kind of cost might i be looking at to do this to a 4sp automatic Element, since an entirely new transmission would be needed, plus labor for a mechanic

 

[nacranym]

what kind of cost might i be looking at to do this to a 4sp automatic Element, since an entirely new transmission would be needed, plus labor for a mechanic

in addition to replacing the transmission and adding the clutch mechanism, i believe you'd have to replace the ECU, as they are different for AT and MT.

 

[Corbinworks]

Couple of 6 speed questions

Couple of questions on the 6 speed swap.

So I have the MT5 in my element & know that 6th can be added..
When doing this do you guys add the reverse lock out?
-
Local guy who builds Honda trans has a OEM LSD for $500, What do you guys think about that price?
-
I got a quote for $250 less parts to convert to 6 speed (Local) feel thats a good price.
-
Also is there a drop in 6 speed that will work in the element from another Honda, That shares the same mounts? Would love to find one with OEM LSD
-

Thanks
-Paul

 

[nacranym]

mine has been running w/o reverse lockout since the conversion about 180000 miles ago.
nevertheless, having the reverse lockout would be nice, but it's not a must have.
$500 for LSD is good price if the unit is relatively new and hasn't been abused. i paid a bit more than that for new Mfactory LSD. Civic Si LSD will fit and there are several others. avoid the ones that explode. <grin>
$250 for the conversion is good if the mechanic knows what he's doing. transmissions and diffs generally have lots of shims that require measure and choose correct shims to keep clearances at spec. a good mechanic knows when to use as is or to measure and re-shim.
don't know of any other transmission that will drop in.

 

[Corbinworks]

mine has been running w/o reverse lockout since the conversion about 180000 miles ago.
nevertheless, having the reverse lockout would be nice, but it's not a must have.
$500 for LSD is good price if the unit is relatively new and hasn't been abused. i paid a bit more than that for new Mfactory LSD. Civic Si LSD will fit and there are several others. avoid the ones that explode. <grin>
$250 for the conversion is good if the mechanic knows what he's doing. transmissions and diffs generally have lots of shims that require measure and choose correct shims to keep clearances at spec. a good mechanic knows when to use as is or to measure and re-shim.
don't know of any other transmission that will drop in.

I want the lock out so I will look in to finding out what I need to make it work.. There has to be a way...
Also what kinda gas mileage are you getting?
I ask because I was talking to someone on the FB page and they said almost 400 miles to a tank :-o when I am only getting 260ish

 

[nacranym]

I want the lock out so I will look in to finding out what I need to make it work.. There has to be a way...
Also what kinda gas mileage are you getting?
I ask because I was talking to someone on the FB page and they said almost 400 miles to a tank :-o when I am only getting 260ish

if you don't put the new 5/6 synchro in, then i wouldn't bother with the reverse lockout. Honda uses straight cut reverse gears and there is no synchro, so there is absolutely no way you could get the transmission into reverse when attempting a 5 to 6 shift. if your shifting is wider than necessary, you might get some whrrr before you realize what's happening and you backoff. i've let other people drive my vehicle.

MPG depends on how i drive it, recently i've been getting about 26. some in town, some highway.

 

[SauceBox]

I've loved the element since they came out,

finally got one (now 2017)
proud owner of an 04 Honda element AWD M/T, and i love it
dream car, 192000 miles on the chassis
little stubby shift, but ope room for independent break lever .... jk

not to mention, the glorious amounts of mods they did to it
got it from a guy in Sf that diddnt want the project any more,

to start,
Motor swap with a Acura tsx Vtech *(was told this was the "i" because of the red lettering and probably from a TSX S) 94000miles
so more HP, and it most defiantly ****s and gets....
also injen carb legal cold air intake, injen SS cat back exhaust, Hondata Ecu, new Oem coil over suspension, with adjustable camber kits, new tires, new upper and lower control arms, corrabu seats, some other cool stuff but looks stock on the out side , my brave little toaster is a sleeper , and it gets like a MF
all the work at a shop in Sf, about 6 months ago,

it also came with a box of "special extra" parts, to add a 6th gear,
what a wonderful endeavor this will be, the tyranny just started a tick, so i believe this will be a sooner project than later

it gets it, hellment,

want to add cosmetically/ functionally, wheel spacers to add to the width, and a rack and gobi style ladder, and bush guards
its a beautiful car, and it most defiantly ****s and gets, with the extra under the bonnet, looks like a sleeper, and boy, shes saucy

anyways, i wanted to hop in here, being it just developed a ticking that my mech suspects is the input shaft bearing possibly,

so i need to rebuild the tranny, and synce i have all the parts mentioned in a box, am going to get this in there too, why waste $600 in parts, because she most defiantly needs it lol

i will be following this thread, religiously, and must applaud all you guys for your esteemed efforts and hard work, proving more is just simply better
thank you, and i will be chiming in soon