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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
I’m just seeing if anyone has had this issue before. Currently have a cel for my O2 sensors sensing a rich fuel mixture. The cat was replaced recently and it isn’t a quality replacement if I’m honest. That maybe unrelated but figured I’d mention it. The car cranks but doesn’t start. I don’t hear the fuel pump either. So I swapped the pump relay and now the pump but it’s doing the same thing. So I’m thinking it’s an electrical issue, possibly a bad ground to the pump. I’ll start digging in tomorrow but just wanted to see if anyone dealt with something like this before.


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Discussion Starter · #3 ·
Mileage? Last valve adjustment date?
170k and I just did a valve adjustment on it less than a year ago. It had a random misfire before that from the valve adjustment not ever being done. It ran perfectly fine up until a couple weeks ago. It had the code come and go for a month before that. Then it abruptly shut off on the highway one morning. I got it to restart and get to where i was going and home again where it refused to restart. It sat for a few days. I noticed I couldn’t hear the fuel pump so i started figuring that must have been the problem. It randomly started again but made weird clicking noises from the passenger side so i replaced the relay. That wasn’t it either since it decided to play dead again and the fuel pump still isn’t priming. I’ve swapped the fuel pump and still the same thing. So now I’m thinking it’s a ground or something.


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Service manual should help you locate those grounds to check them for contact. I was gonna say sparkplugs but you're talking about fuel pump. Possible that fuel pump was culprit when car went dead during drive. Might have multiple things at play here. When did you last get a tune-up? (Plugs, coils, filter, etc). Hopefully it's not a burnt valve issue.
 

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Discussion Starter · #5 ·
Service manual should help you locate those grounds to check them for contact. I was gonna say sparkplugs but you're talking about fuel pump. Possible that fuel pump was culprit when car went dead during drive. Might have multiple things at play here. When did you last get a tune-up? (Plugs, coils, filter, etc). Hopefully it's not a burnt valve issue.
It’s not throwing a misfire. Typically, with ignition issues, the car will misfire. That said, i changed all that last year chasing a misfire that turned out to be a valve adjustment issue. I don’t hear the pump at all. There’s definitely something going on there. I currently have the rubber floor up with the pump exposed, i turn the key and don’t hear the pump even turn on. It’s just weird how it’ll sporadically flip on and i can turn it over. But the other day where i heard clicking, that leads me to believe there’s a bad ground somewhere. Likely at the pump or possibly connected to the relay.


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Discussion Starter · #6 ·
It’s a bad connection somewhere. I just got it to start. It’s so weird. I don’t see anything obvious. Currently have the center console open and tugged on that wire loom and it magically got the pump to turn on. I’ve had bad grounds before but nothing like this.


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You mention in your first post that you installed new fuel pump and new fuel pump relay, and the issue is still there. I'd check the wiring and their connections. It sounds like a loose connection just barely making enough contact sometimes. GL! Post your end result. Alot of threads never have the result.
 

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Discussion Starter · #8 ·
You mention in your first post that you installed new fuel pump and new fuel pump relay, and the issue is still there. I'd check the wiring and their connections. It sounds like a loose connection just barely making enough contact sometimes. GL! Post your end result. Alot of threads never have the result.
Yea i figured out it’s definitely an electrical issue. I will for sure take a few pics to help as I’ve read that this isn’t an uncommon issue but no one has taken pictures. I suspect either a loose wire in the connector, a wire grounding out or a bad ground


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I get supersticiuos in those cases. I figured someone is playing a prank on me and installs a remote switch somewhere along the wire and i cant drive unless they turn the switch on lol

On another note. I have made it a habit to hear the relay finish clicking & pump prime and proceed to crank. I've found it's always a sure-shot each time. Maybe my days as a teenager priming my dad's weed wacker got something to do with it.
 

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Discussion Starter · #10 ·
I get supersticiuos in those cases. I figured someone is playing a prank on me and installs a remote switch somewhere along the wire and i cant drive unless they turn the switch on lol

On another note. I have made it a habit to hear the relay finish clicking & pump prime and proceed to crank. I've found it's always a sure-shot each time. Maybe my days as a teenager priming my dad's weed wacker got something to do with it.
If i pull and push the part of the harness that goes through the floor, i can hear the pump prime. I’m guessing a wire is loose or grounding out.


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If i pull and push the part of the harness that goes through the floor, i can hear the pump prime. I’m guessing a wire is loose or grounding out.


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Sounds like you have some tedious laborious electrical diagnosing ahead.. Reminds me of a starting issue i had years back that ended up being the sensor wiring hardness to the tb. GL!!
 

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Discussion Starter · #12 ·
Sounds like you have some tedious laborious electrical diagnosing ahead.. Reminds me of a starting issue i had years back that ended up being the sensor wiring hardness to the tb. GL!!
Yea it’ll for sure be tedious and time consuming. I’m hoping to get to it tomorrow if not Thursday. I’ll take photos to help anyone that might come across the same issue.


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On my 03, at the fuel pump connector, black wire is ground and yellow/green wire is battery power. Yellow/green wire originates from PGM-FI main relay 2, behind the glove box in front of the ECU.

The fuel pump connector is part of the wire harness called the “abs/fuel pump harness” and will go forwards into the floor to connector C558 and into the “right side floor harness”. Next connector towards the ECU is C559 which is in middle of the dash. It would seem that If your can get things to start by pushing on the floor, that hopefully testing at the fuel pump and at C558 will help you narrow down where the problem is.
 

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I’m just seeing if anyone has had this issue before. Currently have a cel for my O2 sensors sensing a rich fuel mixture. The cat was replaced recently and it isn’t a quality replacement if I’m honest. That maybe unrelated but figured I’d mention it. The car cranks but doesn’t start. I don’t hear the fuel pump either. So I swapped the pump relay and now the pump but it’s doing the same thing. So I’m thinking it’s an electrical issue, possibly a bad ground to the pump. I’ll start digging in tomorrow but just wanted to see if anyone dealt with something like this before.


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Check the ground wire running under the battery tray. That ground can cause gremlins like you're describing. The ground wire tends to corrode in half due to battery acid.
 

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Discussion Starter · #15 ·
Check the ground wire running under the battery tray. That ground can cause gremlins like you're describing. The ground wire tends to corrode in half due to battery acid.
I’ll check that. I plan to tinker a bit tonight before bed. This was really bad timing with the holidays.


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Discussion Starter · #16 ·
Doesn’t seem like a ground issue up front. The engine bay grounds seem to be newish.

Here is where the problem area is.



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Discussion Starter · #17 ·
If i play with this part of the terminal, i can get the pump to turn on and start.



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Discussion Starter · #18 ·



Now that I’ve got the protective sheathing off, it doesn’t start again. Fuel pump not turning on. (Yes i had it plugged in.) I checked the yellow wire with the green stripe and there doesn’t appear to be any issues at the connector on either male or female ends. I’m thinking it’s somewhere on that sleeve at the floor or on the underside of the car. I hate electrical problems so much. I’m going to pull the seat out just to check for a ground under it. I doubt I’ll find one but you never know.


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Discussion Starter · #19 ·

There is a ground under here, but i don’t think it’s the issue. I pulled the bolt up just to make sure there wasn’t a ton of corrosion. There was not.


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since the gas tank is below the floor pan and the first connector is above, I would wonder if the wire is chafed when it goes through the hole. Looks like you can see the hole in that floor in the center console area…

also, are you checking for the presence of power and ground at the cables in addition to visually inspecting? in other words, when the pump is broken, check for the presence of power and ground at the pump, then check the power and ground at the harness connector. Hopefully power and grounds are at the harness connector and one of them is absent at the pump. you then know your problem is in that particular wire and you can scrutinize that single wire.
 
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