[Taoist Warrior]

I have always been a 5 speed kind of guy. I like having more control over the driving experience, getting better mileage, and having something to do with my hands. But traffic here in san diego is getting worse and worse and driving a stick is getting to be a nightmare. I have been considering primarily 2 vehicles for my next car: either a 5spd EX AWD E or the upcoming turbo subaru baja. The thing I like about the sube is it's got AWD, more ground clearance than the E, more refinement, and has plenty of power so the auto/shiftmatic tranny wouldn't have bothered me.

But... I testdrove an EX AWD auto today and i was pleasantly surprised at it's power. I mean it's no hotrod, but being somewhat close to honda's target demographic with the E (27 year old active male) I could probably stand to drive a slower vehicle and avoid a few tickets! So as far as i'm concerned, i'd buy an auto. too bad I don't have a down payment to put on that shiny black one at the dealer....

 

[meanelvis]

cool analysis man.

as a 25 year old active guy who test drove both a baja and an element, i hear ya.

what it came down to for me was ultimately the fact that the element was obviously meant to be a hip, functional vehicle all at once. i felt that the baja was slick and all, but to me it wasnt enough el camino to be totally hip and it wasnt enough suburban to be totally functional. that mixed with a base price 5k more was plenty to convince me. honestly, the test drives felt very similar for me.

dont take what i'm saying as attempting to sway you towards the element but those were my observations happy car shopping man, sounds like you're not doin things on impulse.

by the way, with the economy how it is lately, most dealerships will sign a 0-down deal with ya. my salesman seemed surprised when i told him i wanted to put down 1k.

 

[boneheadz]

DISCLAIMER:
I really don't like the bashing that we do on this board about other brands or types of cars and trucks. But I can't help myself here so no disrepect.

the upcoming turbo subaru baja

Oh my god, no no no. I think this was the worst idea ever. Even worse than the neon. It is a car missing its hatch. there is no utility to this thing. for me, the most important thing in a vehicle, is what it can do. This can move people and a few groceries and thats about it.

Please, just say no to the baja. and it sucks that they used such a cool name for a toy.

End rant.
Hope I didn't tick anyone off.

 

[foxtail]

I'm with you, Bush555. In 30 years of driving, I've never had an automatic before, and until I drove the E auto, I never considered one. An automatic always seemed like a cop-out to me, like not really driving.

But. when I was E-shopping (in April) the EX 4WD 5-sp was still somewhere in the future. I drove the EX 4WD auto and was amazed at the pep. So I bought mine.

I'm amazed at how easily I've adjusted to the auto. I can always kick off the overdrive if I need that extra push for passing or mountain-climbing, just like I would have downshifted to 4th in a 5-sp.

I will confess to occasional pangs of remorse, especially when the 5-sp came out about a month after I got my E.

But, overall, I'm very pleased with my choice. Wimpy or not, it's very nice to relax and not have to worry about shifting. And with the pep of the E, really feel like I made a good choice.

 

[Kayakin' Dan]

Actually everybody says I am. I've been in automatics for years and years, except for my 3 speed 1973 Chevy Pickup, but that doesn't count, since you almost have to double clutch to shift from 1 - 2. I drove the auto-E and thought it was very ho-hum. But the 5 speed? What a blast, I hadn't had that much fun shifting since my '67 LeMans with the Muncie StoneCrusher 4 speed. I don't have to commute in traffic either, but at least give the 5-speed a shot!

 

[4rachnid]

I've had the unique experience of owning both a 5 spd and auto Element. I bought the 5 spd and got sick of it in traffic after about a month, so I traded up to the AWD auto. I get better gas milage with the auto, can talk on my phone, can hold my gal's hand, can drink my drinks, etc. I won't be driving a 5 spd again. The technological advances in computer controlled transmissions have made the shifting quicker and more economical than they used to be, autos got a bad rap in the beginning cause yeah they sucked. Maybe they aren't as fun by some opinions, but I'd rather be doing other things than shifting gears. Not trying to flame, I just think autos are better these days.

 

[Taoist Warrior]

For me it's not the rowing through gears i mind so much as the clutching. It's damn near impossible to make it home after a leg workout at the gym in normal traffic, much less stop-and-go. I agree that a five-speed is more fun and I would probably miss it a lot. I wish more manufacturers would make clutchless manuals or at least shiftronic trannies (that's part of the appeal of the baja for me.)

As far as element vs. baja... they both have their advantages. Naturally the E has more enclosed cargo room, etc.... but you can haul a new fridge in a baja. and you don't have to worry about scraping the bejesus outta the undercarriage with 8.5 of clearance and skid plates/rear diff. protectors. And as peppy as the E may be, the sube is a turbo (!). But you sure can't sleep/camp in it! I mean you have to give credit where it's due. Each manufacturer has a cool crossover on the market and you just have to decide which suits you better. Naturally I'm leaning toward the E for the above and other reasons (price too...)

Note on gas mileage- the reason why auto AWDs get better mileage than manuals is that in the case of the E or a subaru, the AWD isn't actuated until slippage occurs. in a manual, all four wheels are being driven all the time so you lose a mile or so of fuel economy per gallon. but to me that's negligible.

i'm surprised to hear that there are dealers out there that'll finance with $0 down... seems like with the demand for these things they wouldn't deal so much, unless honda worked out the Gen Y finance plan... lol

 

[batman]

I have to agree that ANY car with a stick you will have more control over as you pass through the gears...especially in bag weather. BUT driving in normal every day traffic is not worth the aggrevation of going through the gears of 1-2-3-2-4-5-3-2-1- stop....stop stop.... it just easier to do normal travel with an auto. My Blu-E is the first vehicle that has an auto and I am happy with it. If I did more travel on the open road and can actually drive it, then I would be missing the stick.... honda s2000... thats a stick car no matter what.... 2010 I will get one... it will be 10 years old then and still driving and smiling in my E.....
good luck... you wont be dissappointed with the auto...... and your leg will like it.
BATMAN

 

[SteveO]

Ha, this is a fun topic. I'm an mt man, though I must admit to some easy relief feeling whenever I climbed into my wife's TL at not having to shift. But for me, the auto E awd didn't do it...I didn't try the od thing, that probably makes a lot of diff. But I've grown used to mt...I shouldn't be on my phone in traffic anyway, so stick's a good deterrent...and absolutely hate it when I'm on the interstate, want to scoot ahead, but can't due to sluggishness. So 5 gears for this E owner.

Baja vs. E -- yeah, two wild and crazy cars! E for me, though! Plus a friend's Subie Forester has had some mechanical and quality-headache issues...

Batman -- don't wait 10 yrs for your S! Trust me, now is the time!

Steve

 

[batman]

Thanks for the vote of +++ reinforcement. Wish I could afford that s2000. I am in the process of building a log home in the NC mountains and I need the cash right now. One that gets underway and in 10 years when the s2000 is running about 10K.... then I am going to be spurting to the mountains and using every gear I have,,,, all 6! Until then me and E will be poking in traffic but I wont be wearing out the leg and ARM!!!!! When ever I am at the dealer, I just sit in the s2000 in the show room and hang out in it... atleast until people stop asking me questions or do even see me.. >LOL>

Just want to say thanks for this web site!
BATMAN