Two different cars. Depends what you want to haul around. People will probably be happier in the ford. Dogs, bikes, tall plants and odd shaped stuff will probably be happier in the E.
se

 

First, consider what your driving and your driving style are. If you drive with a heavy foot or in mostly highway or not-stop-and-go city driving, the hybrid will not meet expectations. That said, if you DO drive it properly, the Hybrid can get excellent mileage.

Next thing, consider whether you want seating for four or five, rubberized floors, manual transmission, et cetera.

I've driven the Escape Hybrid on several occasions, and it's a very nice vehicle. It rides well, and if you NEED to merge onto the freeway NOW, it can get out of its own way. However, the Hybrid really shines when you drive it gently and let the batteries do as much as they can.

If you can get the Escape Hybrid for a decent price and your driving is a lot of stop-and-go, consider the Escape Hybrid. If you're doing a lot of highway driving or you really really need the rubberized floors, get the Element. Test-drive both and remember that the Hybrid's mileage will suffer noticably if you shove your foot into it.

 

Thanks for the feedback. You make good points Xequar. I tend to be heavy footed and do a fair amount of highway driving. Right now I drive a Prius and get in the low 40's (I know people who get 50). I am wondering how that will equate to the FEH. I actually like the Element better, wider seats, more flexible, but gas prices will go back to $4 plus sooner rather than later, and that gives me pause.

 

MSRP to MSRP your looking at about $8K difference in price between the two.
Looking at the E. even at $4 a gallon, that extra $8K will buy 2000 gallons of gas, equal to 40,000 miles at 20 mpg.

So you also need to work out your "break-even" point (when you would recoupe all the additional purchase and maintenance costs in gas savings) on the Hybrid vs. the E - matched to the life/mileage of each vehicle.

Depending on use and the distance you drive per year, the E could actually work out to be more economical than a Hybrid.

For example Left Lane magazine calculates that at $3.60 a gallon, the Toyota Highlander Hybrid SUV will take about 12.7 years to break even at "average" yearly mileage, compared to the similar gas only model, while the Saturn Aura Green Line will take 24.3 years. The Lexus LS 600h L would take 102.6 years to reach break even.

 

So you also need to work out your "break-even" point on the Hybrid vs. the E - matched to the life/mileage of each vehicle.

Depending on use and the distance you drive per year, the E could actually work out to be more economical than a Hybrid.

I agreed with mkh.

Consider if you drive approx. 12000 miles per year as average.
Use worst case of average $4 gas price, 40mile/gal for Hybrid, & 20mile/gal for E. You will pay $1200 more in gas for E yearly, but it will take almost 7 years to break even.

I don't know about quality of Ford Hybrid vs E, but E has been most dependable compact SUV in JD Power for 2 years in a roll with re-sale value of 40% at 5 years vs only 26% for Frod Escape Hybrid, based on Kelly Blue Book. Better dependability == less cost for the fix.

I would do the math 1st, & look at the bottom line in $$ for the years you plan to own this car.

 

E vs. E

You might have limitations should every want to tow something behind the H Escape. Also, cargo capacity, hands down goes to the Element.

 

Wow... didn't realize the FEH was that pricey.

FWIW, our E replaced a 1st-gen Escape. The FEH solves one gripe we had - fuel economy - but relative to our outdoor activities and hauling needs the Escape's interior was too prissy and access was vexing for handling anything large and awkward.

Quality wasn't too bad, although there were some question marks about the transmission (CD4E). That's not a factor in the FEH.

 

Thanks again for the feedback. If I were buying new, it would be a no-brainer, I would go with an Element. As noted, it would take a long time to get your money back on the difference even at high gas prices.

But if I buy used, that analysis changes. The FEH apparently depreciates faster than the Element, so that the prices almost converge. Hence, price-wise used, the FEH could be justified.

As also noted, most hybrids do not make sense economically at current prices. The Prius is an exception (get your money back in about 60,000 miles compared to a nonhybrid Camry-similar size--at $2 per gallon). The Honda Insight may be one as well.

 

Maybe it's just me but I wouldn't even consider a "used" Hybrid anything unless it had a pretty good warranty leftover...and even then I'm not sure.

 

I agree, right now Hybrids are all using NiMh Hydride batteries which if used properly are only good for about 4-5 years. And to replace that battery your looking at a few thousand dollars. I have yet to see a single cost benifit breakdown of a hybrid both price and carbon footprint, that makes them worth it. The batteries in these things are heavy have 3rd lowest power density of any of the current battery techs and are both environmentally and health unfriendly.

Now I if I could get a plug in with 100 mile range under 10K that uses LiFeP04 chemistry (1000+ cycles half the weight close to 3 times the power density) I'd have another new car next to the E.

As is the hybrids on the road today (excluding prius/insite) are just gimmicks to make people think they are helping the environment or saving cost of gas.

 

To some extent, the used market is making the irrational more rational. Used FEH's don't always sale for a big premium over nonhybrid Escapes. That is also somewhat true of the Toyota Highlander, but not as much as it is for the Escape.

 

Also consider the used car value, I know not a lot of people like E but the value still hold up better than Ford IMHO.

I got a used E last year 2004 with 70k for 11k out to door. And my brother in laws just got his Ford Explorer 2008 less than 2k mileage 4WD Eddie Bauer edition, all leather, all premium for 18k out to door. That thing is starting at 28k brand new and dropped 10k in a year.

We don't really get along well because he always talk big. I told him that he really got a good deal but I was laughing inside me that that thing will drop value like crazy...

Even if you are planning to use it forever, Honda is always the choice.

 

That comparison is actually pretty invalid, because anything in the Explorer/TrailBlazer/large SUV size range took a massive nose dive on value. Generally, Hondas do hold resale a bit better, but that gap is narrowing over the past couple of years.

And as a conversation point, my mom's 2005 TrailBlazer, that was a $32,000 car new, is now worth $7,000, and hers only has 41,000 miles on it. Like I said, all SUVs took a huge hit, and the bigger the SUV, the bigger the hit.

Thanks for the feedback. You make good points Xequar. I tend to be heavy footed and do a fair amount of highway driving. Right now I drive a Prius and get in the low 40's (I know people who get 50). I am wondering how that will equate to the FEH. I actually like the Element better, wider seats, more flexible, but gas prices will go back to $4 plus sooner rather than later, and that gives me pause.

Given that, you might do better with an E. The Escape Hybrid is a heavy car, so if you shove your foot into it like you would in an ordinary car, you're gonna knock it down probably 4-6 mpg out of the gate in stop-and-go driving just because you're using a lot of energy to get the car moving. Now, if you drive it really gently and maximize the battery time versus engine time, you can get the Escape Hybrid, in stop-and-go mixed driving, near or possibly even past 40 mpg.

As to some other points mentioned, quality on the Escape has improved greatly since 2001, and at this point, I wouldn't hesitate to consider one because of quality. As far as hybrid technology and batteries and whatnot, well, it's not a state secret that I think Hybrids are mostly marketing buzz and a covert way for the OEMs to do research into electric vehicles. BUT, you say you already drive a Prius, so obviously you've resolved the "hybrid technology" questions to your own satisfaction. IIRC (big IF), there was originally an eight-year warranty on the Escape Hybrid batteries. I could be wrong, but it's worth looking into.

 

I came from a Ford Esscape to a Element

I had a 2001 v6 XLT Escape 2wd.Bought used in Jan 2008 for $4200 with 120K on the clock.Not a bad vehicle BUT here are the issues I had with it:

It's snow performance is bad,had good tires on it too.I have owned many front wheel drive cars and this was one of the worst for snow,plus it is heavy when you get it stuck.

The rear wheel arches rust out easy.At 135K there was a 8" section that was gone to rust.The rear door body cladding hid it from view so you never seen it,but it was there.

Also,had a oil leak,mediocre heat,and 3 COP failures at $80 each for the part(COP is the COIL ON PLUG ignition sys the 3.0 uses).

In short it was good for a while,hauling 5 people,snowboards,RC model planes and several friends moving.

When I bought it the value of it was over $9000.At trade time for the E I had to beg to get $3200 for it,and it was CLEAN except for the things I spoke of.

Plus hybrid battery packs are not cheap.A good friend of mine Steve C works for a auto shop in Madison.If your AC fails in the Escape,you loose the hybrid function as the AC cools the pack.

Buy the Element,you will be happy,I love mine!!!

Perry Brokaw

 

Safety issues

The 2009 Ford Escape has improved significantly on safety issues, if you look at the current reports of the Insurance Institute for Highway Safety. However, in roof strength, the Honda Element is good while the Escape was marginal, as was in the news this past week. So Honda still has the edge in safety I think.

Both vehicles have ESC though they go by different names. I choice the Element partially because of its safety features, but the most important reason was: I REALLY liked the vehicle!

Good luck on your decision.

 

Thanks for all of the great feedback. The last few posts were especially helpful. I keep hoping for someone who has driven both recently. What I think I need to do is see if I can rent the Escape and check it out. Apprently the Escapes are available for rent, Elements are not as best as I can tell.

 

ZipCar does rent Elements but it just depends if they're in your area of the country. You can rent by hour or daily.

http://www.zipcar.com/

 

I have a 07 EX AWD, my wife has a 08 Escape Hybrid. Her Escape is nicer comfort wise, my E has more room and is more configurable. She drives in heavy traffic and is in electric a lot of the time and her on board info center says she is getting 35mpg. I drive in a rural area mostly and have copier parts and tools on board and average in the low 20s. She likes the way her Escape drives and says it is easier for her to see out of than my E. She also has front sun roof, heated leather seats and mirrors and power seats. We have a daughter and we have travel on trips in both vehicles and everyone likes the extra room in the E over the Escape. They are both good vehicles, we have had not problems with the Escape in 14k, or my E with 74k. So I would say it just depends on your expectations of comfort and versatility. Drew

 

2009 Hybrid Models & 2009 Tax Credits
Ford Escape 2WD Hybrid — $3,000
Ford Escape 4WD Hybrid — $1,950
Mazda Tribute 2WD Hybrid - $3,000
Mazda Tribute 4WD Hybrid - $1,950
Mercury Mariner 2WD Hybrid — $3,000
Mercury Mariner 4WD Hybrid — $1,950
Nissan Altima Hybrid - $2,350

 

FYI: If you pay the alternative minimum tax, you cannot use the credit. If you are close to paying it, the credits may not be fully useable all in one year, though what you cannot use in one year can be carried forward and used in a future year.