[Outside]

clarification on spring rates

Locksmith, thank you for your research and providing this thread for us.

I need to clarify though that an extra coil means more material to flex, so if the spring is wound from the same gauge wire it will get "softer" as it gets longer and stiffer as it gets shorter. More coils equals a longer wire, more material, more flex.
The thicker wire helps make up for the extra coil.
The extra preload makes a difference too, but too much preload has its own problems.
The extra coil might help make up for the extra preload, I dont know.

You have a bunch of them and say this is a good solution if you keep your Element loaded with a few hundred pounds of weight. Your recommendation is good enough for me to give it a try. Most of the crap I read on internet forums is from people who have never done what they are recommending.

I just wanted to mention that an extra coil does not mean more load capacity.
Thanks again.

 

[Novasteve74]

This is indeed true. More coils equals a softer spring rate, meaning less load capacity. The stock Element spring WILL fit on the CR-V shock though, so you can just run that if it fits your needs. This would actually prove to be a little cheaper since you'd only need the shock itself, and not the rest of the assembly.

 

[Locksmith]

That's so counter intuitive to me I'm having a hard time wrapping my head around it.

Straight from Monroe's site "Coil spring strength, or rate, is determined by the length and diameter of the rod. Decreasing the diameter of the rod, the number of turns, and the tightness of the turns increases the strength of the spring. Increasing the rod diameter or the number of turns, or increasing the space between turns reduces spring strength."

So literally, less is more.

I posted this when we finally did the mod to my E. I got the extra ride height but the best thing I got out of it was the straight line handling. I always had a hard time keeping it in a straight line on the highway with the sagging rear end. Now I can relax and cruise. I have also noticed more travel in the rear but not in a bad way. Going over speed bumps and stuff, It feels more even. Equal amounts of travel even though the rear is loaded. It has not bottomed out.

Now I want to try the Monroe CR-V strut with the OEM Element spring and see how it works.

 

[Brianf7028]

I love this because Old Man Emu fro n Australia makes a suspension lift kit for the CRV. This offers a lot of posibilities. So am I correct to think that CRV and Element springs are interchangeable?

 

[Locksmith]

Pretty much. The top hat is what's important.

 

[Atom]

I've got custom springs on order so I have suddenly taken a keen interest in all this spring stuff.

As the number of active coils increases, the spring rate decreases. If a spring's rate is linear (most racing springs have linear rates) its rate is not affected by the load put onto the spring. For example, a linear rate spring rated at 500#/inch will compress 1" when a 500# weight is placed onto the spring.

https://fastguys.weebly.com/uploads/9/0/4/5/9045988/coil_springs.pdf

 

[PedroGringo]

We also install adjustable upper control arms to take care of the camber issue.

Hey Locksmith. Thanks for this whole thread. Helps a lot.

One quick question: Which adjustable upper control arms did you use?

Thanks again.

Pete

 

[Locksmith]

We've bought many brands over the years. Lately, most non OEM parts we get from TPH and they stock Movetech.

 

[Atom]

Mevotech

 

[Orange Peelin']

Hey @Locksmith, what front Monroe Struts kit did you use? Do you have a model number? Love your whole setup.

 

[Locksmith]

They're Monroe Quick Struts 172135 and 172136.

 

[Orange Peelin']

Thanks @Locksmith. I forgot to ask what year is your element? Mine is a 2010 and I keep seeing things that say the Monroes front struts kit won't fit on anything after 2006.

 

[Locksmith]

Mine's an 05.

 

[Cueballsi]

Mine's an 05.

Did you ever test with the element spring vs the CRV spring??

Can you use the bushings from the Monroe mount and put them in the CRV top hat?

great info by the way. Just picked up a 200k element. Needs suspension pretty bad. Did You ever use KYBs? Wonder if KYB kit would yield the same….

 

[Cueballsi]

That's so counter intuitive to me I'm having a hard time wrapping my head around it.

Straight from Monroe's site "Coil spring strength, or rate, is determined by the length and diameter of the rod. Decreasing the diameter of the rod, the number of turns, and the tightness of the turns increases the strength of the spring. Increasing the rod diameter or the number of turns, or increasing the space between turns reduces spring strength."

So literally, less is more.

I posted this when we finally did the mod to my E. I got the extra ride height but the best thing I got out of it was the straight line handling. I always had a hard time keeping it in a straight line on the highway with the sagging rear end. Now I can relax and cruise. I have also noticed more travel in the rear but not in a bad way. Going over speed bumps and stuff, It feels more even. Equal amounts of travel even though the rear is loaded. It has not bottomed out.

Now I want to try the Monroe CR-V strut with the OEM Element spring and see how it works.

Did you try the CRV struts with Element spring combo?

i noticed the crv FRONT coil also has less turns than the element

 

[Locksmith]

I did not. Time goes by and wasn't on my mind any more.

 

[Cueballsi]

I did not. Time goes by and wasn't on my mind any more.

No worries. Thanks for the info.

I did not. Time goes by and wasn't on my mind any more.

No worries. Thanks again for the info

 

[woodi]

Thanks to this thread I recently put CRV struts with Element springs in the rear of my Element and the results are excellent. Honestly i think this is how it should have come from the factory. I used Sachs CRV struts from Rock Auto and tracked down some new Moog Element springs from Autozone (they were sold out almost everywhere). I used my old element top hats and everything went together great. I didn't measure the lift since my old springs we're so trashed that there was a lot of sag. But now the rear sits higher than the front, even with a couple hundred pounds of tools in the back. I haven't had a chance to hook my camper up yet but I suspect she'll sit level when I do. For anyone carrying weight in their element or towing this is a super easy suspension upgrade definitely worth doing.

 

[Cueballsi]

do you have pics of what it looks like not loaded with gear?

Thanks to this thread I recently put CRV struts with Element springs in the rear of my Element and the results are excellent. Honestly i think this is how it should have come from the factory. I used Sachs CRV struts from Rock Auto and tracked down some new Moog Element springs from Autozone (they were sold out almost everywhere). I used my old element top hats and everything went together great. I didn't measure the lift since my old springs we're so trashed that there was a lot of sag. But now the rear sits higher than the front, even with a couple hundred pounds of tools in the back. I haven't had a chance to hook my camper up yet but I suspect she'll sit level when I do. For anyone carrying weight in their element or towing this is a super easy suspension upgrade definitely worth doing.

 

[woodi]

Here ya go, I took the tools out and went for a lap around the block. I haven't replaced the front struts and springs yet so I'm not sure if it would level a little more with fresh springs up front. This is definitely settled in though, They've been on there for a few month's now.