[bork]

#396 • 6 mo ago

bork said:
Still running great since 4/8/2019! (even in heavy rain storm)

Update: Still going strong! (almost hate to mention)

2nd update; over a year now, YEAH!!!

 

[Fleetw00d]

To really diagnose it, you need to measure the oil pressure on the engine at the switch.

 

[Dudecatchesfish]

P2646 Error and resolution

I, too, had issues with my oil solenoid/ oil pressure switch. Actually replaced it twice. Error recurred shortly thereafter in each case. I discovered that the 2 wired connectors that are attached to the solenoid are NOT waterproof. On a hunch, I pulled the 2 connectors which I quickly discovered had moisture inside. Solution was to take some cotton swabs and clean the contacts on all 4 surfaces, take a hair dryer and dry them out as thoroughly as possible, then apply a liberal amount of dielectric grease around the base of the wired connectors, being careful not to apply any to the metal contacts themselves.
Putting the connectors back in place will force the grease to both the outside and inside surfaces sufficient to keep out any moisture. Since we had MAJOR rain here in SoCal last week, driving in this horrible rainstorm was a true test of my remedy. No more issues or codes for this solenoid. Hope this helps!!!

BobM

I have an 03 that is having these issues, just had a new solenoid installed and it came right back but I am hoping this may be it! Thanks.

 

[Dudecatchesfish]

Not trying to beat a dead horse...

But I have the old p2646 thing going on currently, have replaced the whole solenoid, not just the oil pressure switch, have been changing the oil every 1000 miles, and for the last 3500 miles or so, I'm still getting the CEL, and for the same p2646. So my question is...
1) has anyone had this issue resolve itself over time with more frequent oil changes? My mechanic seems to think that it will resolve itself this way.(I just purchased the car in January of this year)
2) the issue of not being able to drive faster than 57mph kind of sucks, I have a 47 mile commute to work, and it's mostly highway...does anyone happen to know the top speed of an E with p2646 on, if I do the 6 gear conversion? My car has no other problems otherwise. Thanks in advance for any advice.

70 mph exactly for me but that thats null on an incline.

 

[Dudecatchesfish]

Found My Problem

Well after 3 years of spewing money at this issue...and numerous hours of diagnosis, and several mechanic shops / dealers (6) I have discovered my issue.

I took it to my 3rd Honda dealer service center the other day and they kept it overnight... I originally just wanted to re-flash my computer to make sure it wasn't messing with the system...The head technician took me back to the car and we reviewed some of my previous diagnosis. I explained how I haven't checked under the timing cover yet. They kept it over night and spent the next day looking behind the timing cover. They discovered my timing chain was stretched, cams were worn, and there was a lot of sludge in the cylinder head... I have only had this vehicle since 2015 and am the 4th owner... They said I need a new engine (which I suspected a while back). With all that is now wrong with the vehicle besides needing an engine, I now am looking into buying a CRV EX-L to replace this disaster of a situation I have been living with for 3 years. I hope this helps others that have spent any nest egg they may have had chasing this dragon... Check the timing chain/cams. Good Luck.

Thanks for the tip. Im praying to the Honda gods that this is not my issue but I believe I have the same.

 

[TAZ Teri]

Well my dear EOC friends I have had my first problem with my Element after 96,000 miles. While driving down the road the other day my malfunction indicator lamp came on. I instantly thought it was my gas cap so I removed and reinstalled it and took off again but I started cutting out and losing power. I instantly thought it was an 02 sensor, plugs, wires, or cat. convert. so I took it in to Autozone this morning to have the code pulled and got [PO2646 Rocker Arm off or stuck] code. I have never heard of such a code so I took it in to my dealership for them to hook it up and see what they find. I was wondering if anyone else has heard of this code or has any clue what could be the possible cause. Ill keep you updated.

I have been having problems with this code (2646) for over a month now. My Mecanic is stumped. We have replaced Rocker arm, and did a complete oil change, Tune up and full service on AC. Replaced coils. Replaced oil pressure solenoid. And still code #2646 comes up! Also miss fires comes up. It chokes when taking off from signals. Don't know what to try next.

 

[Betterintheory]

Oh boy..I wish I had known of how common this issue was before I looked at Es and bought mine.
Hi everyone. New owner and member here. Unfortunately I'm in the changing my vvt boat. Problem with mine is the hardware is stripped. I'm sorry if this has been asked...446 posts in this thread....does anyone know where I could get new mounting hardware??

 

[Steve B]

I agree, battery/system voltage can affect system faults- I had a Chevy HHR that started throwing an ABS light- I noticed, if I just turned the key on and waited for all the dash lights to clear and then started the engine, I didn't have any ABS fault pop up. I purchased a LCD DC volt readout that lugs into the 12v dash jack- the numbers quickly told me that my battery was not holding a full charge overnight- maybe 12.2-12.4 volts. A new battery fixed the ABS dash light-
Being an electrician, I should have figured this out a lot sooner! Having a 50% charged battery plus old plug-in connections to the VTEC solenoid and pressure transducers might give a faulty reading to the engine computer--
one of these is about $12-14 on Amazon- and you still keep your phone charging jacks.
View attachment 202868

 

[Steve B]

Xangryth's advice was spot on for me. Had intermittent code P2646 and tried everything. Cleaned the front screen, replaced spool valve assembly, changed oil, tried 10W-30 with OEM Honda filter. Nothing worked. Checked battery voltage and it tested okay, but was 3.5 years old so I replaced it. It solved the problem for all of about $80 and 10 minutes worth of work. My advice, if you check the oil level and it's good go ahead and get an oil change. If that doesn't solve it I'd consider a new battery. Fixed the dreaded nightmare P2646 for me

 

[larrh7]

Xangryth's advice was spot on for me. Had intermittent code P2646 and tried everything. Cleaned the front screen, replaced spool valve assembly, changed oil, tried 10W-30 with OEM Honda filter. Nothing worked. Checked battery voltage and it tested okay, but was 3.5 years old so I replaced it. It solved the problem for all of about $80 and 10 minutes worth of work. My advice, if you check the oil level and it's good go ahead and get an oil change. If that doesn't solve it I'd consider a new battery. Fixed the dreaded nightmare P2646 for me

For how long has the light stayed off? I see your post is 4 months old. Is it still off. Mine the lights come and go but the Element runs great. It will be off a for a few day and then come on. Stays on for a few hours or a day. Then it shuts off and might be off all week. Crazy. I had it in back in March because the spool valve assembly was leaking oil. It ran fine. They changed it and about a mile from shop it came on. Put two more on and it didn't fixe it. Finally light shut off and it ran fine until about a week or so ago.

 

[larrh7]

Has anyone really figured this out yet? My 04 started leaking oil around the spool valve assembly in March. I took it to a local mechanic and he changed the whole spool valve assembly. Leak stopped by a mile from his shop check engine light came on and it started bucking . Took it back. He changed it again. Ended up changing it 3 times more. I was getting pretty upset . Light then went off and didn't come on again till about 2 weeks ago. Element is running fine doesn't do the bucking when I punch it down hard. Light goes off for a few day and then it comes on for a few miles or few day. Off and on for no apparent reason. Still running just fine. Oil is changed battery is fine, had it check. If anyone really has an answer please let me know. Seems like no one knows for sure even the Honda Dealer mechanics. Been reading a lot about this problem. Thanks for reply if you know the answer.

 

[Fleetw00d]

Don't just keep throwing parts at it. Have it diagnosed correctly; have someone measure the oil pressure at the valve/switch. How many miles on the engine? Have both screens been changed? What weight oil are you using?

 

[Xangryth]

I'm glad a new battery helped! A smart engine control computer can be tricked, if old wiring contacts and a weak battery don't give it the right input. The VTEC system was never designed to be easily diagnosed on a high mileage engine!! (Be sure to check the battery to frame ground cable connection!)
I saw a Honda engine teardown video on youtube and they traced out the oil flow for the VTEC system. There were many oil passageways through the block and head in that system, so high mileage sludge could reduce oil flow= the low oil pressure switch fault is actually telling the truth! I am just saying, if Honda had put in real analog oil pressure transducers in that system near the last pressure switch and one at the oil filter, a whole lotta useless parts swapping would have been avoided. Nobody wants to hear the bad news that their engine is worn out and that is why the oil pressure switch faulted on the VTEC. I also saw a Honda engineering item that said the design life is 250,000 km for this engine.
I take that to mean- all bets are off after that number is reached. You will then have to put money into replacing worn parts. Try not to buy an E with mostly city mileage. I made a topic here where I explain - with pictures- how to separate out the city driven cars from the highway mileage ones.
My Element was a good one for me. But I will never own another one. When I sold it and switched back to my 3rd Chrysler minivan I figure it out immediately what was wrong- the high center of gravity and short wheelbase made it a great to drive in town, but I subconsciously knew the body could lean beyond my comfort zone at higher speeds- you absolutely can not relax your concentration at high freeway speeds with this car. With my 2010 minivan, I can easily drive 75mph and have no mental worries. My old school 3.8L cast iron push rod hydraulic lifter V6 ( no timing chain) may not win MPG contests, but almost any good mechanic can work on it.

 

[Xangryth]

This is what I would do with a VTEC low pressure fault- always assume the PS is telling the truth, just like the old school oil pressure idiot light on the dash!
#1 Replace the oil and filter- USE 10-30W oil to increase the oil pressure at startup and after the engine warms up. (10-30w is approved for that engine in a Lexus) Unscrew the oil cap and look under the valve cover with a bright LED light for any signs of sludge- if you have sludge, use a can of engine cleaner before the oil change. I use one on every used car I have ever owned on my first oil change. The sludge cleaner might just unclog your VTEC shift valve oil screen, too.
Next check the battery connections and ground connections- if in doubt replace the battery.
BUY that ten dollar 12V plug in digital readout to monitor you battery health. Do that right away.
The dealers and mechanics will never suggest this stuff, because they their make money replacing parts. Take a picture of this and save it on your phone to jog your memory , just in case trouble happens later.
If none of this works then it parts diagnosis and replacement time
. But if your problem is fixed with the 10-30w oil, then it likely means your engine is getting worn and nearing it's end of life. That is the final solution that element owners don't want to hear.

 

[larrh7]

Don't just keep throwing parts at it. Have it diagnosed correctly; have someone measure the oil pressure at the valve/switch. How many miles on the engine? Have both screens been changed? What weight oil are you using?

I took it to the mechanic and he diagnosed it and took the action. Oil has been changed screens cleaned you name it. Others have tried the oil pressure thing with no positive results. That is the only thing I have not done. Others have went to Honda and had computer updated screens clean and all the other things you mentioned with no results. If Honda doesn't have the answer who does? It's a 04 EX all wheel drive with 155,000 miles on it. I'm second owner. I did the 100,000 mile recommended service myself. I've taken excellent care of it and changed the oil every 4000 miles since I've had it. Always used the 5-20 synthetic oil. By the way I've not thrown parts at it nor money.

If anyone has a solution please let me know.

 

[larrh7]

This is what I would do with a VTEC low pressure fault- always assume the PS is telling the truth, just like the old school oil pressure idiot light on the dash!
#1 Replace the oil and filter- USE 10-30W oil to increase the oil pressure at startup and after the engine warms up. (10-30w is approved for that engine in a Lexus) Unscrew the oil cap and look under the valve cover with a bright LED light for any signs of sludge- if you have sludge, use a can of engine cleaner before the oil change. I use one on every used car I have ever owned on my first oil change. The sludge cleaner might just unclog your VTEC shift valve oil screen, too.
Next check the battery connections and ground connections- if in doubt replace the battery.
BUY that ten dollar 12V plug in digital readout to monitor you battery health. Do that right away.
The dealers and mechanics will never suggest this stuff, because they their make money replacing parts. Take a picture of this and save it on your phone to jog your memory , just in case trouble happens later.
If none of this works then it parts diagnosis and replacement time
. But if your problem is fixed with the 10-30w oil, then it likely means your engine is getting worn and nearing it's end of life. That is the final solution that element owners don't want to hear.

I will try the 10-30 oil. I've always used the 5-20 synthetic like it says to. I'll also try the plug in battery monitor. I did have my battery checked and it's in great shape. I installed a larger CCA one last winter so it's only a year old. I don't think my engine is worn but who knows. It doesn't buck and stumble when you excellent hard. Running like a top. I've prided myself in the care I've given it. Changed the oil every 4000 miles and did the complete 100,000 mile recommended maintenance myself. Rear end fluid and transmission fluid was change my me again at 150,000 miles. I'm at a loss. I've read where many many are having the same problem. Not just Element owners. Honda Pilot owners are having the same issues I read on their forum. Just as this Element forum read they have went to Honda mechanics and others with no results. It's a shame Honda Dealer Mechanics can't even figure it out.

 

[Fleetw00d]

I took it to the mechanic and he diagnosed it and took the action. Oil has been changed screens cleaned you name it. Others have tried the oil pressure thing with no positive results. That is the only thing I have not done. Others have went to Honda and had computer updated screens clean and all the other things you mentioned with no results. If Honda doesn't have the answer who does? It's a 04 EX all wheel drive with 155,000 miles on it. I'm second owner. I did the 100,000 mile recommended service myself. I've taken excellent care of it and changed the oil every 4000 miles since I've had it. Always used the 5-20 synthetic oil. By the way I've not thrown parts at it nor money.

If anyone has a solution please let me know.

The system operates on oil pressure, if it is low for whatever reason, it can cause the problem even if the switch and solenoid are working correctly. To diagnose it correctly, you need to know what the oil pressure is, ideally both near the pump and up at the VTEC switch. My daughter's only did it after about 45 minutes of highway driving when the engine got good and warm. She finally had to insist that they actually put an oil pressure gauge on it and drive it for 45 minutes; they were able to duplicate the problem. Her engine is now at about 220,000 (long story, previous partial rebuild); she is currently running 5W30 oil. The code still comes up once in a while, she has stopped using her E for long trips. She might try a 5W40, but is considering other options. I get first dibs on her E (I have an engine here at the house I could rebuilt for it).

 

[07lmnt]

The best way to diag this is with an oil pressure reading. You would have to T into the pressure circuit at the VTEC solenoid. The rocker arm pressure switch opens @35 psi. Less than that the switch will not send the signal to the ECM and a code will set.
There was a post, somebody had found a switch that fits, but opened with less pressure.

 

[Fleetw00d]

The switch may open with less pressure, but there is a certain amount of pressure required to compress the springs under the pins in the rocker arm to switch them to the other cam lobe.

 

[07lmnt]

The switch may open with less pressure, but there is a certain amount of pressure required to compress the springs under the pins in the rocker arm to switch them to the other cam lobe.

Yeap.
That guy never did let us know if it worked out.